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Survivor San Juan Del Sur

Connoisseur, you should know that Rocker is famous for wearing his Speak English T Shirt. The producers knew this was guaranteed to happen. Do also be aware that the term ghetto trash has racial tones so might be the reason this is escalating.

Well how is it any different to trailer trash? Would that have been a better choice of words? Point is nat is trash to me of whatever kind you prefer or don't selectively take umbrage at.

I used ghetto because she does come across as some 'merican women (abrasive, ruded and ignorantly opinionated) that went on shows like jerry springer. *shrugs*

Connoisseur, you should know that Rocker is famous for wearing his Speak English T Shirt.

Like I said I don't know squat about the guy and that goes for other baseballers, grid iron, hockey players etc... And I'm basing my opinion on the Survivor contestants on what I've seen of them on the show and nothing more. It's unfair, uncouth and uncalled for to drag up stuff that they've done in the past as a form of ammunition to take down on a reality show.
 
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From the outside I think that is more PC. I would just say that it was an opportunist cheap shot, that worked brilliantly well. I think both Jeremy and Natalie acted the whole lot. At the time I thought Natalie getting bent out of shape was funny as she was Sri Lankan. Technically Rocker hasn't really offended her in her past unless she profiles herself, and racial profiling is a no-no.
 
Well I think that says a LOT MORE about Rocker (not harbouring grudges which he would be completely justified in this instance) than it does about Nat.

Unfortunately for nat I don't make up my mind about individuals based on by how they're perceived by other people that I like/respect. I have to get to know her on a personal level for my opinion of her to change dramatically from what I've seen of her on Survivor. Until then my low opinion of her remains.

While it does say a lot about Rocker I agree ....I am not an overt racial minority (yet) in my country and though it is cliche to say it I havent walked a mile in their shoes. However if I was coloured and already in a minority position, and found out that another player in the game has a reputation as a racist I would be concerned about my future in the game if that person was in a position of power. Thus I would do whatever possible within my means to rid that person from the game to further my chances. I dont happen to think its dirty pool, Rocker brought that on himself when he returned to the public eye.

. From Jeremy and Natalie's perception he was a danger to their standing in the game and needed to be taken out..rightly or wrongly and as fast as possible. Also remember that Natalie's sister was the first person voted off from Rockers tribe and on discovering who he was and his reputation you can be certain that she felt he was behind it and was pissed.

Anyways I respect your opinion on the matter, just trying to present how I felt about it. Its not your obligation to like Natalie.
 
While it does say a lot about Rocker I agree ....I am not an overt racial minority (yet) in my country and though it is cliche to say it I havent walked a mile in their shoes. However if I was coloured and already in a minority position, and found out that another player in the game has a reputation as a racist I would be concerned about my future in the game if that person was in a position of power. Thus I would do whatever possible within my means to rid that person from the game to further my chances. I dont happen to think its dirty pool, Rocker brought that on himself when he returned to the public eye.

. From Jeremy and Natalie's perception he was a danger to their standing in the game and needed to be taken out..rightly or wrongly and as fast as possible. Also remember that Natalie's sister was the first person voted off from Rockers tribe and on discovering who he was and his reputation you can be certain that she felt he was behind it and was pissed.

Anyways I respect your opinion on the matter, just trying to present how I felt about it. Its not your obligation to like Natalie.


However if I was coloured and already in a minority position, and found out that another player in the game has a reputation as a racist I would be concerned about my future in the game if that person was in a position of power.

Hmmm I'm not so sure I buy this line of thinking. I'm assuming that in this day and age that most individuals who apply to be on Survivor are unlikely to harbour blatantly racist ideology, let alone try to play the game along ethnic lines if only because doing so (and being obvious about it) would almost certainly put a huge target on their back.

Had Rocker shown any inclination to play in this idiotic strategic manner, I'm sure the producers would not have passed up this footage and milk it for all it's worth to boost up the ratings. The fact that we didn't see anything of the sort makes me lean towards giving Rocker the benefit of the doubt on this one

IMO you gotta be absolutely damn sure you have got all your facts straight the moment you decide to start throwing serious accusations (racism, paedophilia, etc..) of that sensitive nature around. It is not something that should be done lightly. Especially when it's said in front of all and sundry, immediately impacting the reputation of that person often for the worst.

And no, relying on the word of some embittered angry entitled arrogant douchebag with an obvious revenge agenda does not fall in that category. lol

It seems to me that there is an unspoken acceptance for people to flippantly call others racist and suffer no negative consequences in return if they're proven to be baseless and false.

I wonder whether the perception of nat's rant would be different if it was about him being say.... a paedophile instead. Not doing your due diligence can result in people taking you to court for defaming a person's character in the public arena and nat can consider herself lucky that in the eyes of the law alleging that someone is a racist is not deem serious enough to warrant legal recourse.

However in this case it is much worse since all nat had on Rocker was what someone else had relayed to her about him; like myself she had no fucking idea who the hell he was. lol

If I hadn't know any better I could've sworn that nat was well versed in every incident Rocker was allegedly guilty of uttering racist/bitgoted opinions over the last decade or so, such was the strength of her conviction in her ridiculous emotional expletive ridden diatribe.

Not that her actually knowing about Rocker's sketchy past lessened the severity of her actions, it was a still a low class act regardless.

And that's what I mainly took issue with nat about as it was unnecessarily obnoxious, spiteful and low, traits that I abhor in people. Someone with a bit class about them would not have gone there, not even to win a million dollars. I guess some are willing to overlook it (or don't deem it sufficiently important to affect their opinion of her) but to me it is most definitely a deal breaker.
 
I think Rocker knew what he was in for. He wanted to vote out muffin for the crime of knowing who he was. Not that he was rich, but that the skeleton was in the closet. I think both Jeremy and Nat had each lost their pair and threw pleasantries aside. Jeremy was scorned, perhaps mistakenly, over Rocker promising to protect Val. That spiralled into the tirade. I like Jeremy, but he sure was sewing seeds in anyone who would listen and it was entirely for the game. I think extreme, but fair play.
 
Wellllll...anyways....to change the subject if Keith wins the next two immunity challenges he wins the game as he has a better story to tell than any of the remaining survivors, Missy, Baylor or Jaclyn and more friends on the jury. Natalie will be gone at F4 if that happens as Baylor and her mom will stick together and vote her out.

Imagine...Keith....dumbest Survivor winner ever. It will give the same inspiration to reality show contestants as it did to amateur poker players when Chris Moneymaker won the WSOP a decade or so ago and created a poker boom....anyone can win this game!
 
okay so I'm late to the party re: John Rocker, and there is a looooot that I can say, but I'll try to sum it up in a few sentences.

I think that ultimately we're all responsible for our actions and words and behaviors, and if you live a relatively high-profile life that a professional athlete lives and you make repeated offensive comments about race and sexual orientation, that shit's out there for everyone to see and hear and it's going to come back and haunt you. And obviously accusations of racism hold a lot of weight to them, but when you've said a shit ton of racist, homophobic, and otherwise blatantly offensive comments that have been documented, it makes those accusations a lot more credible. This isn't a matter of anyone putting words into John's mouth, and this isn't a matter of anyone saying that he said things that he didn't say. I don't blame a black man and a Sri Lankan woman in the slightest for not wanting someone like that in the game.

At the end of the day, I don't sympathize with John for being accused of being a racist because he's said a shit ton of pretty fucking racist things. Similarly, I don't sympathize with Aaryn from BBUS15 just because she was edited as the main racist in the house and other people had more gracious edits. If you don't want to be viewed as a racist, don't give people the option to view you as one. You control what you say and if you use that power to make offensive comments, that's your fault only.
 
I think Rocker knew what he was in for. He wanted to vote out muffin for the crime of knowing who he was. Not that he was rich, but that the skeleton was in the closet. I think both Jeremy and Nat had each lost their pair and threw pleasantries aside. Jeremy was scorned, perhaps mistakenly, over Rocker promising to protect Val. That spiralled into the tirade. I like Jeremy, but he sure was sewing seeds in anyone who would listen and it was entirely for the game. I think extreme, but fair play.

I think you are misunderstanding where I'm coming from. I admit that I didn't mind survivor Rocker, I haven't and won't prejudge him on what has happened in the past. And judging him solely on his time on Survivor I think he was an okay guy. It's possible that over the years he's changed for the better and no longer hold the narrow-minded views he's expressed in the past.

But the reason why I detest the twinnies has got zero to do with Rocker, they could've targeted any other of the castaways to unload their vindictive vitriol and my opinion on them would still remain the same.

No, my distaste for the twinnies is all on them. They are obnoxious, uncouth ignorant loudmouths who get away with the crap that comes out of their mouths simply because they're females. If similar crap came out of a guys mouth he would've being sat on his arse a loong time ago.

The equivalent to the twinnies from BBAU would be a housemate known as Vesna.

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I'd don't believe that I have it in me to ever hit a woman but females of this ilk would definitely come close to breaking me. She was a painfully obnoxious, loud, dumb, ignorant, irritating you name it etc.. pain in the arse. Not to mention a major sleazeball given that she repeatedly and unashamedly threw herself at the some of the guys in the house (she slyly stroked a guy's penis FFS! lol) and she might've even called one of them gay for turning her down. lol I'm sorry but me and females/males with this type of personality just simply do not mix.
 
That's fair enough. I switched off the twinnies season of Amazing Race as they stressed me. For some reason I enjoy the mischief Nat makes on Survivor. I would save my punches for Alec as he sat in the jury looking vacant.
 
I can't help but lol at anyone who defends Rocker. His counterpoint to being labelled a homophobe was to point out that he was aligned with Josh, a gay guy. That's basically equivalent to saying "I'm not racist, I have black friends!" like it's a get-out-of-jail-free card for saying something racially offensive.
 
I loved the twinnies from day 1 on TAR. I dont find them uncouth loudmouths at all and as you will be highly unlikely to ever meet them so you can judge personally I have to rely on other peoples opinions of them....and the fact they are well liked by all the cast including those that Natalie screwed over....Jon/Jaclyn, and Rocker & Tanning salon lady to me speaks volumes. Missy has a Survivor clip where she absolutely lauds all of the positive qualities that Natalie possesses including her determination, physical ability to compete, capacity to work around camp and help out and more. Many of them may be dumbasses but they spent an intimate 40 days 24/7 with her and I will trust their opinion that there is much more to her and probably her sister than we see on a highly edited TV show.

They are obviously as this board shows...polarizing.
 
That's fair enough. I switched off the twinnies season of Amazing Race as they stressed me. For some reason I enjoy the mischief Nat makes on Survivor. I would save my punches for Alec as he sat in the jury looking vacant.
The twin use together just bicker bicker bicker. I have been impressed with Nat on her own. She has made several deliberate moves to get her further. And it has worked. I haven't even been really paying attention this season until the last few weeks. Several Epic TC have made me snap too!

Ghetto is coded lingo for a racial put down for African Americans in the USA. We have issues
 
I loved the twinnies from day 1 on TAR. I dont find them uncouth loudmouths at all and as you will be highly unlikely to ever meet them so you can judge personally I have to rely on other peoples opinions of them....and the fact they are well liked by all the cast including those that Natalie screwed over....Jon/Jaclyn, and Rocker & Tanning salon lady to me speaks volumes. Missy has a Survivor clip where she absolutely lauds all of the positive qualities that Natalie possesses including her determination, physical ability to compete, capacity to work around camp and help out and more. Many of them may be dumbasses but they spent an intimate 40 days 24/7 with her and I will trust their opinion that there is much more to her and probably her sister than we see on a highly edited TV show.

They are obviously as this board shows...polarizing.

I loved the twinnies from day 1 on TAR. I dont find them uncouth loudmouths

That's okay, I don't mind if you do. :)

as you will be highly unlikely to ever meet them so you can judge personally I have to rely on other peoples opinions of them

I will trust their opinion that there is much more to her

I was being diplomatic when I said that but honestly I've seen enough footage (the sheer volume of it) of them in 'action' to know with a certain amount of confidence that the vileness they displayed in the show isn't due to highly selective editing but very much a part of who they are.

Others may find their behaviour somewhat 'endearing' and not that big of a deal, that's absolutely fine to each their own. To me though it most definitely is a character trait in people that I have zero tolerance for. *shrugs*

and the fact they are well liked by all the cast including those that Natalie screwed over....Jon/Jaclyn, and Rocker

Like I said a couple of times already I pretty much found all the contestants on S29 revolting and that includes the twinnies at the very top of the list. The twinnies being 'popular' among among castaways doesn't mean much of anything at all (to me regarding them).

All it says is that those individuals you mentioned are more than likely bigger and better persons than the twinnies. Winners are grinners as they say, nat outlasted all the players you named and might have actually won as well as the fact that they didn't go on long vitriolic rants about the twinnies either. So it doesn't surprise that they don't harbour lingering resentment towards those guys, it wouldn't make sense.

You see it differently and that's okay. I'm not invested in any of them to care what other people's opinions on them are, they're more or less equally vile as far as I'm concerned.
 
The twin use together just bicker bicker bicker. I have been impressed with Nat on her own. She has made several deliberate moves to get her further. And it has worked. I haven't even been really paying attention this season until the last few weeks. Several Epic TC have made me snap too!

Ghetto is coded lingo for a racial put down for African Americans in the USA. We have issues

Obviously I'm not from the US. I just used the lingo that I hear from american tv/movies to describe women who act like the twinnies and the terms 'ghetto trash' came to mind. *shrugs*
 
I didn't like the "burger" talk, but that's the only incident I can recall. Overall I thought Vesna was a fun girl and an entertaining housemate.
 
Obviously I'm not from the US. I just used the lingo that I hear from american tv/movies to describe women who act like the twinnies and the terms 'ghetto trash' came to mind. *shrugs*
Fair enough.... We shall meet agin after The finale!
 
I live in Australia and don't like/care for 'merukin sports (besides the NBA) and thus basically knew zilch about who this fella was prior to him being on Survivor.

If I started mouthing off the same crap about you the same way nat did to Rocker, again based solely on the word on some uppity bitter and twisted punk (Germs, who had a misguided revenge agenda blaming Rocker for his stupid wife being voted out when it was all of her own making) then I take my hat off you for having the composure to take (regardless of whether it is factual or not) on the chin and be a good sport about it, you're a bigger person than me.

I know that I probably wouldn't and it's why I have more sympathy for the way Rocker reacted (the retaliator ) than nat who was the aggressive instigator.

You're missing my point anyway. The reason why nat is repugnant to me it's because she went on a vindictive diatribe spouting very serious accusations (racism) without having the decency of giving her target of her vitriol a chance to tell his version of the story. That's as low as they come and I have not the time day for filthy ferals of that ilk. Don't get me wrong I'm not trying to change your mind, you can view nat however you like, that's fine by me.



Seriously? Are you referring to what Rocker said almost 2 decades ago or him lashing out (understandably out of frustration and anger) at Nat and blurting out she was lucky she was female 'cos he would've whooped a guy's behind for talking so much shit about him in front a group of people?

I'm calling a spade a spade, my conscience is clear about how I've described nat.
Rocker is a poster child for intolerance and racism in the U.S.. His history is well known and he hasn't changed. he makes money selling t shirts that say Speak English, which is a basis for hatred of immigrants here in the U.S..CBS cast him just to cause this kind of controversy. It was stunt casting.

If you don't know that he is infamous for his racism and intolerance in interviews, then you can't really understand where the US cast is coming from.

He may be the most hated baseball player, he definitely was when he played.

Edit: by the way, I agree it is good to know that "ghetto trash" is really inflammatory. I wouldnt use it.
 
Rocker is a poster child for intolerance and racism in the U.S.. His history is well known and he hasn't changed. he makes money selling t shirts that say Speak English, which is a basis for hatred of immigrants here in the U.S..CBS cast him just to cause this kind of controversy. It was stunt casting.

If you don't know that he is infamous for his racism and intolerance in interviews, then you can't really understand where the US cast is coming from.

He may be the most hated baseball player, he definitely was when he played.

Like I've stated on several occassions my intense dislike of the twinnies does not stem from being a 'fan' of Rocker or any of the other castaways for that matter.

He just happened to be on the receiving end of what was the final straw for me in regards to the low opinion I have of the twinnies.

Don't get me wrong I don't consider myself a fan Rocker and thus going out of my way to paint the twinnies in a bad light in a bizarre misguided attempt to stick up for him so please don't continue to bring up his past in an effort to dissuade me from liking him. LMAO :D

Edit: by the way, I agree it is good to know that "ghetto trash" is really inflammatory. I wouldnt use it.

Duly noted.
 
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