Episode BBAU 2020 - Episode 6 Discussion (16 June)

[Mooseface]

Forgive me, but I don’t follow how if Soobong and Angela have such support on this forum it can be that there is SO MUCH apparent racism. Are the people oh this form super more tolerant? I’m not saying biases don’t exist. They do. But Angela and Soobong are strong players. Whatever their ethnicity.

 

[the Theorist]

@Kingston, what are your thoughts on how other aspects of the show have played out so far? Haven’t seen you post here in a few days and I always enjoy hearing your perspective.

 

[Kingston]

@Kingston, what are your thoughts on how other aspects of the show have played out so far? Haven’t seen you post here in a few days and I always enjoy hearing your perspective.

I fell behind a few days due to sourcing issues... I’ve enjoyed the series so far for what it is... It’s refreshing to see a new perspective put in motion. That said my expectations moving forward are going to be much higher. They’ve got a lot of work ahead of them if they plan on putting out a second series.

Obviously Angela is by far my favourite HM. It’s kind of hard not to enjoy watching her and I’m glad she’s getting a second chance, regardless of whether this twist was just waiting in the wings for a prime opportunity to be used. I’ve found it hard to really like anyone else and not because I think the rest are dullards but due to the fact that the storyline is driven by those who seek the attention. I have a feeling a handful of HM’s are waiting in the wings for thier opportunity to shine. Mat is likely one of them...

As I said before I hope this series is seen as more of a pilot that can be adapted from and not a blueprint of what future series will look like... Obviously there will be carryover but there needs to be some significant change to bring the show up to its full potential.

The show needs to decide if it really thinks strategic gameplay is really what they want and if they do we need to see more of it. It’s been refreshing to see stories not driven by game dynamics but at the end of the day we need to see all aspects of “the game” in order for the game to make sense. If the HM’s aren’t giving it up they need to bring it out of them... Either by adding more to the structure of the game, adding more time for things to develop, or in DR sessions.

I’ll try my best to provide input when I can but I’m about 14 hours or so behind... It makes it tough to give real time updates. Most of the time I’d just be agreeing with what’s already been said.

 

[mebe]

Are Australian suitcases made differently or operate differently? I'm not understanding the struggle to pull/push/carry/drag

 

[Kingston]

Are Australian suitcases made differently or operate differently? I'm not understanding the struggle to pull/push/carry/drag

Angela is just being dramatic... She’s a bit of a lost cause when it comes to doing things for herself. Also her case is one that is typically carried not pushed or pulled. As a former flight attendant I’ve seen grown men struggle with much simpler cases. Let’s give our African Kween a break...

 

[Mooseface]

Fuck, Chad takes the cake for the least articulate HM ever on BBAU.

He does seem to like Ange though. So I’ll give him that.

 

[Mooseface]

The same old excuses.

You have 4 POC who were kicked out at the first available opportunity each and every time, out of a house of 20 people. That is statistically impossible without racial bias at play.

Everyone’s been throwing around the word ‘threat’ likes it’s a get out of jail free card. The truth is most of the housemates are an equal threat level to each other but it’s the POC who get picked first because they have to live by different standards. Literally tonight: Angela threat = bad, Chad threat = celebrated. He was smiling and bragging about it on the couch.

You’ve also said the POC have been evicted as a result of them playing the game badly. By this measure Kieren should have been out now too. But he’s not, because there’s double standards. This is the core of racial bias and something that is so frequently wished away with excuses like the ones above.

I think Angela is a mental and physical threat (strongwilled smart and strategic) and Chad is a physical threat (less obviously smart and arguably may be nice but not be very strategic or smart)

 

[the Theorist]

...and Chad is a physical threat (less obviously smart and arguably may be nice but not be very strategic or smart)

Is he though? I had the same issue with Ian using it as an excuse on the couch. Chad doesn’t appear to be doing very well physically at all, at least not where it counts like in challenges. He’s been pretty hopeless actually. So I’m not sure this argument holds up.

It’s almost the same as Daniel. On their own accord, neither have so far been able to live up to the “masc men” label they like to think they are. And that’s what really threatens them.

 

[Kingston]

Is he though? I had the same issue with Ian using it as an excuse on the couch. Chad doesn’t appear to be doing very well physically at all, at least not where it counts like in challenges. He’s been pretty hopeless actually. So I’m not sure this argument holds up.

It’s almost the same as Daniel. On their own accord, neither have so far been able to live up to the “masc men” label they like to think they are. And that’s what really threatens them.

To be honest I do think there’s far to much of a reliance on physical challenges... Most of which have so far favoured people of smaller stature or build. Obviously not all challenges will favour all HM’s... That said having a mix of different types of challenges is essential to give everyone a chance of winning at some point.

Somehow there seems to be a massive disconnect with production... They seem to think there’s a one size fits all solution to every problem and haven’t taken the time to see subtle nuances in the format. Obviously just because something works on Survivor doesn’t meet it fits for BB... Despite the fact that they are both competitive formats. They seem to have slapped the Big Brother name on the Survivor production bible and called it a day.

 

[Mooseface]

Is he though? I had the same issue with Ian using it as an excuse on the couch. Chad doesn’t appear to be doing very well physically at all, at least not where it counts like in challenges. He’s been pretty hopeless actually. So I’m not sure this argument holds up.

It’s almost the same as Daniel. On their own accord, neither have so far been able to live up to the “masc men” label they like to think they are. And that’s what really threatens them.

Well possibly not even. Maybe that is generous. But I think that makes even more sense for them to want Angela gone. I was responding to someone comparing Angela and Chad. I don’t think they want Angela up because she has darker skin. I think she is genuinely a better player and they know it and that’s why they want her gone.

 

[Mooseface]

Her upbringing may well have contributed to her being a better player. She has commented some of the others seem lazy.

 

[Mooseface]

They have a few options. Align themselves with the strong players. Be a strong player. Try and eliminate the strong players. Do some weird snakey game.

 

[l.a.r.a]

Is he though? I had the same issue with Ian using it as an excuse on the couch. Chad doesn’t appear to be doing very well physically at all, at least not where it counts like in challenges. He’s been pretty hopeless actually. So I’m not sure this argument holds up.

It’s almost the same as Daniel. On their own accord, neither have so far been able to live up to the “masc men” label they like to think they are. And that’s what really threatens them.

Do you think maybe the men feel safe and they don't have to try hard, but if they were in danger maybe they would win?

I loved yesterday episode, I am really surprised because I didn't think I would. I love Angela (I even remember her name now ) I am looking forward to seeing what she will do next. I know we see her a lot, but the others don't seem interesting, they don't do much, the boys talk to each other, she is alive, she entertains.

 

[Kingston]

Well possibly not even. Maybe that is generous. But I think that makes even more sense for them to want Angela gone. I was responding to someone comparing Angela and Chad. I don’t think they want Angela up because she has darker skin. I think she is genuinely a better player and thst’s why they want her gone.

But is she really? I mean her last set of nominations were based on the “greater good” rather than actual strategy. Her last round was an obvious move rather than legit strategy. If it’s not racial bias behind the recent evictions it’s obvious production tried to hard to pad the cast with some sort of imbalance... Rather than a well rounded cast. Clearly more thought when in to casting these “diverse” HM’s than it did anything else. The balance is way off if POC were way more interesting than those that fit the “every day Australian” mould.

 

[Tim]

However concluding it must be down to racism, with out knowing for sure is this explanatory principle logical fallacy.

I didn’t say this. I said racial bias is playing a part. There can still be reasons housemates are evicted but it’s biases that cause the POC housemates to go first for the same reasons that are also applied to whites.

 

[Tim]

I read what Laura said and she was a whiny little bitch who was trying to start a race issue the whole time she was in the house.

Yeah you are an explicit racist.

This is classic white fragility reaction when people discuss race issues. The white racists reply with “why do you have to make it an issue” and try to sweep it under the rug. It makes them uncomfortable so they try to make it go away.

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[Mooseface]

But is she really? I mean her last set of nominations were based on the “greater good” rather than actual strategy. Her last round was an obvious move rather than legit strategy. If it’s not racial bias behind the recent evictions it’s obvious production tried to hard to pad the cast with some sort of imbalance... Rather than a well rounded cast. Clearly more thought when in to casting these “diverse” HM’s than it did anything else. The balance is way off if POC were way more interesting than those that fit the “every day Australian” mould.

Well I would argue she is. She’s good at challenges (mostly). She’s entertaining and is getting alot of airtime and has managed to somehow escape being evicted despite being voted out. And she’s very popular here (and I gather on social media).

 

[Kingston]

Well I would argue she is. She’s good at challenges (mostly). She’s entertaining and is getting alot of airtime and has managed to somehow escape being evicted despite being voted out. And she’s very popular here (and I gather on social media).

At the end of the day the argument being made is about racial bias not racism... Whether it’s intentional or unintentional it’s hard to argue it’s not at play here. The more the contrary point is argued the more it points to the real issue here and it’s painting those members in an unfavourable light.

 

[Mooseface]

At the end of the day the argument being made is about racial bias not racism... Whether it’s intentional or unintentional it’s hard to argue it’s not at play here. The more the contrary point is argued the more it points to the real issue here and it’s painting those members in an unfavourable light.

Well I for one especially like Angela. I don’t know that that should paint me in an unfavourable light

 

[Kingston]

Well I for one especially like Angela. I don’t know that that should paint me in an unfavourable light

Your comment is the same as saying you can’t be racist because you’re friends with a POC.

The best way to handle issues with racism or racial bias is;

- Assume you have it
- Listen to experts about it
- Don’t spread it
- Be willing to change yourself to end it

Making excuses accomplishes none of those things.