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Do we have a politics thread to discuss things political?

Affable

Well-Known Member
The states have no choice but to run hotel quarantine. As the Federal Government won't.

I'm not brainwashed at all. I am just practical and reasonable. This isn't even a Victorian breach of quarantine that caused the lockdown. Constantly referring to it as such is being deliberately misleading. It's being in bad faith.

We don't know the total number of breaches that have occurred. More have happened than we know of.

The number of identified HQ breaches in Australia between April 2020 and June 2021 is 21.
  • three in Queensland
  • eight in New South Wales
  • two in South Australia
  • five in Victoria
  • three in Western Australia.

This google doc doing the rounds has 28.
  • Three QLD
  • Ten in NSW
  • Two in SA
  • Seven in Vic
  • Six in WA
Not sure the difference, may be significant breaches in the first.

WHY IS NSW SO MUCH WORSE AT HOTEL QUARANTINE??? That Korrupt Koala Killing premier must take responsibility and commit seppuku.

So the premise Victoria is on its own level of incompetence with HQ is simply false. NSW has had more breaches. Why aren't your buddies on Sky News complaining about that?

I had to laugh at that practical and reasonable characterisation. Brainwashed more like it.

Since you like stats so much... Here are some more stats for you:


Arrivals by state since the beginning of the pandemic:
NSW - 125,826
QLD - 48,975
WA - 36,908
VIC - 31,559

Victoria only taking 1/4 of international arrivals that NSW have YET almost the same amount of hotel quarantine breaches than NSW says a lot.

Plus, NSW Hotel Quarantine was not responsible for killing over 800 people due to government incompetence like Victoria.

As for this part of your post:
So the premise Victoria is on its own level of incompetence with HQ is simply false. NSW has had more breaches. Why aren't your buddies on Sky News complaining about that?

Maybe do your research first before making misleading statements.

 

Drama

♥️
I had to laugh at that practical and reasonable characterisation. Brainwashed more like it.

Since you like stats so much... Here are some more stats for you:


Arrivals by state since the beginning of the pandemic:
NSW - 125,826
QLD - 48,975
WA - 36,908
VIC - 31,559

Victoria only taking 1/4 of international arrivals that NSW have YET almost the same amount of hotel quarantine breaches than NSW says a lot.

Plus, NSW Hotel Quarantine was not responsible for killing over 800 people due to government incompetence like Victoria.

As for this part of your post:
So the premise Victoria is on its own level of incompetence with HQ is simply false. NSW has had more breaches. Why aren't your buddies on Sky News complaining about that?

Maybe do your research first before making misleading statements.

Those stats are shocking. NSW taking in more arrivals than QLD, WA and VIC combined? I didn't know it was that bad. I don't think anyone can make the argument that VIC is the most vulnerable to outbreaks with arrival numbers that low.
 

Isee

Socially approved socially distanced
Awesome site donor
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Another way to look at those numbers. how many breaches per positive case in HQ. Vic and WA are both way lower in the 1 in x when compared to the other states.
 

Isee

Socially approved socially distanced
Awesome site donor
Trollolololo. Some Melburnian and her hubby high tailed it out of the lockdown all up the east coast and has now tested positive in Caloundra.

Whoops I thought this was the virus thread.
easy to see why you would think that lol
 

Converse

Well-Known Member
Does Victoria have a mandatory QR scanning system in place and if so, how long has it been in place?

Hi I have been to places like banks, post offices, supermarkets, chemists etc during this whole pandemic since it started early in 2020 here in Melbourne and I have only just noticed that they have placed up those QR scanning code sheets at the entry points at the local bank and also at the local supermarkets etc. These have not been around at all until this latest lockdown came around here in Melbourne in my own observations. I don't eat out at all so I can't speak for the hospitality venues but going by news reports I think these places may have been more stricter when it comes to check in scanning i'm not sure.

As I have mentioned earlier in the Virus thread, it seems that alot of this check in relies on the trust and honesty of scanning these QR codes on the individual to do the right thing. Now most people do the right thing but also many do not and some just don't bother with it at all.

Like for me I don't have a smartphone so I can't scan or check in anywhere they have a QR check in sheet. So I just basically walk on by whenever I see them. I was at a Commonwealth bank the other day and they manually filled in a sheet with my details as I don't have a smartphone. Today I was at my local shopping centre again and visited 3 supermarkets and I can tell you the only one that actually has a person at the entrance waiting with manual check in sheets to fill in was Coles. This is the only place where I manually filled in my details before entering the supermarket. I later went into Woolworths where they have the QR scanning code at the entrance. But as I can't scan myself in I looked around and there is no way to manually fill in a time sheet so I just went in and done my shopping as usual. Mind you last week there was an employee at the entrance to Woolies where I did manually fill in my details. This week there was no one.

Then I went into Aldi where there was no change since I was there last week. No way to manually fill in a time sheet at all. I didn't really notice if they had one of those QR sheets at the entrance at all? So anyway I just went in and did my shopping again and left like last week.

It seems to me like this system is certainly directed towards people having a QR scanning capable phone. It also seems that only some retailers go that extra step and also place some sort of manual fill in sheet for those like me who don't have a smartphone to scan in wherever I travel to.
 

up_all_night

Well-Known Member
Awesome site donor
I had to laugh at that practical and reasonable characterisation. Brainwashed more like it.

Since you like stats so much... Here are some more stats for you:


Arrivals by state since the beginning of the pandemic:
NSW - 125,826
QLD - 48,975
WA - 36,908
VIC - 31,559

Victoria only taking 1/4 of international arrivals that NSW have YET almost the same amount of hotel quarantine breaches than NSW says a lot.

Plus, NSW Hotel Quarantine was not responsible for killing over 800 people due to government incompetence like Victoria.

As for this part of your post:
So the premise Victoria is on its own level of incompetence with HQ is simply false. NSW has had more breaches. Why aren't your buddies on Sky News complaining about that?

Maybe do your research first before making misleading statements.


Leaks vs a number of arrivals are perfectly valid. The point is leaks occur. We don't catch all the leaks. What do you think all those wastewater covid alerts are? Leaks that aren't caught and fizzle out. I don't know if this is the case, but I have read Victoria may just be better at detecting leaks than other states after last years experience last year.

I think you're not grasping that the issue is multi-variable. It's not down to one failure, by one level of Government. A big part of these multi variables is unknown and could be down to chance as well as be uncontrollable variables.

The only breakdown in HQ that can really be pointed to was last year and improperly trained staff who lacked any common sense. This was combined with the poor timing of the EID festival and large gathers. Which happened to focus on socio-economic groups which tend to do low skilled menial work, like security or work in age care.

Multiple things stacked up. If an infected security guard was some incel loner, maybe there'd have been no outbreak.

Let's look at aged care, that is where the majority of the deaths occurred. Every single aged care death in Victoria happened in a Federally run aged care facility. Something categorically went wrong in Federal aged care, that did not go wrong in state-run or private aged care in Victoria. Yet you will not at all think the Federal government has responsibility for that.

I think you're blinded by partisan politics to see this is a multi-variable. We can point to one specific breakdown last year. Otherwise, it's just speculation and non-bayesian thinking.

Failures are top-down from Federal to State. This current outbreak isn't even from a leak from Victoria. So arguing what is going on is the Vic governments fault is pointless. This outbreak appears to have now spread to NSW and QLD. I suspect even with that being the case, you will blame VIC for those cases and not go back to the breach in SA.

Australia is going to continue to how leaks and outbreaks until we get properly run quarantine.

Or we reconsider how we bring people back. I have heard from people who work in the COVID industry that a surprisingly large number of people "returning" have never been to Australia before. Somehow have passports or gained access. Don't have anywhere to stay once they leave HQ. That the system for leaving and coming back to Australia has some major flaws. With people travelling back and forth multiple times from hot spots.

It's also somewhat amusing, I'm the apparent brainwashed Labor supporter. Yet I'm the more cynical and least trusting of Government. My view is that this is a global pandemic, I don't trust any level of Government with the current policies to be daddy and protect me. Which it seems you believe they can, even with flawed policies. I am the one demanding better. Not thinking the politicians I support are perfect and will shield me from the deadly virus.

I don't think my view on this at all would be different if Vic had a Liberal government, or the Feds were Labor with the same policies. You will scoff at that, but I think my arguments that Donald Trump's failure was overblown with COVID. On par with the failure of Europe and everywhere hit at the same time in similar levels. Nothing next level worse. Shows I'm not ideologically blinded to one side of politics.
 

Columbo

Somehow I Still Believe
Daniel "I hate freedom" Andrews soon to be goose stepping into parliament to see what other freedoms he can take away from those poor trapped Victorians. I think he should get some advice from the Queensland Premier on how to competently lead a Government.
 
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