In The News

[up_all_night]

from here:
http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/...ancient_jew_hatred_returns/desc/#commentsmore

When defenders of Israel have to equate any criticism of Israel as being anti-semitism in origin. They are admitting they can't defend Israel on the facts.

To his question

'Why does the Left only protest when Muslims killed by Jews?'

This isn't a left / right issue. This constant framing of things is something the right does as some kind of presentation that there's always two distinct alternatives. Plenty on the right are against Israels atrocities against the Palestinians. Further to this, Gillard, Shorten ect are all massive Israel supporters. Trying to frame things as left / right is a way of telling people on your side, which tends to always be the right saying this, that they don't need to listen to the other side. They know people can be convinced on the facts about Israel to not support to persecution and oppression of the Palestinians. The last thing supporters of Israel want is for people to truly be informed. They can't win on the facts. Hence label everyone as anti-Semitic to try and claim there's no legitimacy so people remain ignorant to the facts.

It's simply a tactic to stone wall debate as it's a debate Israel can not win on the facts and realities.


Further to Bolts point. Syria killing Syria is not a conflict we are supporting.. well not directly. It's a different context when it's Western Colonialists committing crimes against those they colonise and a regional instability.


People protest in Australia because countries like Australia enable and allow the Israeli actions. Once Israel loses international support it will have to stop its land grab and try and make some sort of peace.


If we protest Syria or Isis, what Australian policy change can help those people suffering?

 

[Jam]

@up_all_night
<rant>You're wasting your time responding to Derspatz. He has faith, not logic; and because he has faith, he thinks that he is never wrong and he never questions. He is absolutely, 100% certain that his beliefs are true and irrefutable.

I think he is wrong. There are many, many compassionate Christians, Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus etc (and atheists) who are horrified by this conflict and who are able to differentiate the hegemonic content of ancient texts from current reality. Sadly for him (and for us), it seems that he has no free will or independent thought and must rely on these ancient hegemonic texts, reinforced by the smoke and mirrors of the current right-wing shock jocks, to inform his world view and to make sense of his existence.

Poor Ders. I feel very sad for him, really, despite his apparent lack of kindness and compassion toward others whom he so clearly believes are made in the likeness of his God. A questioning mind is actively engaged with this fluke of life, which we all should be able to enjoy, and should not be limited by the accident of where and to whom we are born.
</rant>

 

[derspatz]

@up_all_night
<rant>You're wasting your time responding to Derspatz. He has faith, not logic

Oh, so you think it is faith and not logic to have the following view.

IF Israel = EXISTS
THEN "what the bible says about the Creator and sin and salvation and all that" = TRUE
ELSE "what the bible says about the Creator and sin and salvation and all that" = FALSE

To quote a certain Jewish hero of many (largely thanks to his portrayal of a certain logic favouring character) ...



As for our UAN, did you notice how he failed to mention that it is Egypt who has imprisoned the gazans ? Did you notice how he failed to mention how Egypt controls various border crossings into gaza and how they search out and close down tunnels into Egypt territory ?

as per: http://www.npr.org/blogs/parallels/2014/07/26/335332220/the-long-history-of-the-gaza-tunnels

Did you also notice how he failed to mention how many gazan children hamas killed by forcing them to dig tunnels for them ?

Did you also notice how he failed to mention how it was the Arabs in both 1948 and 1967 who attacked Israel and that in the case of the 1967 war, after the Arabs had attacked again and were once again humiliated by Israel for their efforts, that Israel TRADED LAND FOR PEACE with Egypt.

... or did you not notice such things because you weren't aware of them anyway ... and would prefer not to be aware of them, for that matter ?

Anyhoo, I enjoyed reading the following from "watermelon crusher" today ...

Watermelon Crusher replied to Mr. Jordon
Tue 29 Jul 14 (09:46am)
... It is the surrounding Arab contries that keep Gaza in its overcrowded and underperforming state. Gaza, and the people in it, are a propaganda prison pawn in the Arab struggle to destroy Israel. And, as a propaganda pawn, the reason why Hamas has no scruples about putting civilians right where they know Israel is going to attack - just to create casualties, again, purely for propaganda purposes only.

Islam wants to destroy Israel because the Koran did not predict the re-emergence of Israel but predicted instead that the Jews would remain a diasphora - in contradistinction to the Christian Bible which DID predict the re-emergence of Israel. For Muslims, destroying Israel is preferable to facing the truth about their own religion. The people in Gaza are prisoners of the Arab League, to ‘maintain the rage’ against Israel.

The original and topic that inspired it can be found here: http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/...locaust_teach_the_jews_a_lesson/#commentsmore

regarDS

 

[derspatz]

Don't watch it Jam lest your faith be shaken by plain truth and logic !

regarDS

 

[Inigo Montoya]

Anyway.... In other news.....

http://www.vice.com/en_au/read/what-google-trends-can-tell-us-about-australia?utm_source=vicefbanz

 

[Jam]

IF Israel = EXISTS
THEN "what the bible says about the Creator and sin and salvation and all that" = TRUE
ELSE "what the bible says about the Creator and sin and salvation and all that" = FALSE

regarDS

Okay. If it's set out in a vague semblance of logical form and there are 'equal' signs and words saying 'true' and 'false' then it must be logic, right? Looks, sounds, waddles etc., it must be a duck?

The flaw here is that Israel's existence is not dependent on a belief in a Jehovan god, a belief in sin or in salvation, any more than sugar being sweet is dependent on roses being red or violets blue. Israel is a political entity that exists in this world now and would still exist if that political state had been named Mavis. It's existence is not dependent on the bible but is certainly a literary reference. Like Avalon. Or Walhalla. The fact that Victoria has a very lovely town named Walhalla does not mean that the Viking gods are real.

 

[derspatz]

... and our strawman favouring UAN definitely won't want any of you to watch this bit of history and learn how often Israel has offered the Palestinians their own state ... including even sharing Jerusalem as their Capital.

Israel wants peace. Islam/Hamas et al do not.

Israel uses weapons to protect their children (including the children of Arab citizens of Israel ) whereas Islam/Hamas use their children to protect their weapons.

Hamas/Islam don't want peace, they want the complete and utter destruction of the nation of Israel and to wipe the Jewish people from the face of the earth. After that, they want to do the same to The West and to establish their "no friend to women, education, or personal freedom" totalitarian regime globally.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_citizens_of_Israel
... but at least they aren't a charitable and prosperous and self-reliant democracy like Israel, yes ?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_citizens_of_Israel
regarDS

 

[Connoisseur]

I was listening to a Howard Stern rant supporting Israel. Same old shit as this and more. The same old lies that nothing was there. That it's all anti-semitism. However later into it he gave away something really revealing. Made reference to it's like saying America should give the land back to the Indians. So for all this giant big rant with all sorts of ignorant and false statements about the area of palestine before the creation of Israel.

As a matter of fact the mideast situation is very similar to the colonisation Native Americans (Indians are in the subcontinent) and Aborigines were subjected to. The difference being that I doubt euro descendants would tolerate Aborigines lobbing bombs non-stop over Melbourne and would probably just exterminate them in one fell swoop if that was a tactic Aborigines decided to ever employ to regain back their lands.

The other big notable difference is that Jews have only 'taken over' a very small parcel of land in comparison to the vast amount of territory europeans proclaimed as their own (read: entire CONTINENTS) not to mention the fact that Jews actually have a valid connection to the territory they occupy whereas europeans invaders hundreds of years ago had absolutely none.

There's still plenty of Middle Eastern land that belongs to so-called 'Palestinians' (read: muslim territories such as Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Iraq etc...) who the vast majority are in reality recent immigrants from Jordan, Syria and Egypt and thus have very tenuous links to the land they insist has been theirs for thousand of years.

I think Israel comes out looking fairly reasonably if you compare it to european colonization.

 

[derspatz]

Okay. If it's set out in a vague semblance of logical form and there are 'equal' signs and words saying 'true' and 'false' then it must be logic, right? Looks, sounds, waddles etc., it must be a duck?

The flaw here is that Israel's existence is not dependent on a belief in a Jehovan god, a belief in sin or in salvation

There is no flaw because the whole notion of Israel / Children of Israel / Chosen etc has God at its origins, purpose, and continuance and the bible recorded promises regarding it/them from before it/their existence through to times still yet to come.

Israel vindicates the bible ... and it has been doing so for thousands of years.

Belief (in the context of faith) doesn't need to come into it because Israel's existence (etc) directly correlates with what was promised and faithfully recorded from long ago. The enemy of our soul and all those who have chosen to side with that one have been trying to thwart and pervert our Creator's promises from the very beginning, particularly in relation to the descendents of Isaac and Jacob.

They even went so far as to torture and kill the Jewish born flesh our loving Creator chose to be born into and live amongst us in for a time. They thought they had won back then too but they in fact had just kicked an own goal as they soon discovered when HaShem turned up in "Abraham's Bosom" / "paradise" and "led captivity captive" after doing a bit of preaching about how the enemy of our soul had lost its rights over us and the world was now rightfully Yeshua's and won fair and square, etc.

The children of Israel and all who have accepted the free gift of salvation that Yeshua offers continue to be a painful reminder to the enemy of our soul as to how and when it lost, so it is no surprise that it continues to rally against both the nation of Israel and against those who are able to gladly acknowledge Yeshua Ha Mashiach as having been raised in the flesh from the dead and as being their saviour and Lord.

In short, satan hates us all but in particular it hates the Children of Israel and it hates Christians.

It particularly hates the fact that Israel exists because the existence of Israel is a toe-stubbing reality that what ELSE the bible has to say about things to come will indeed come to pass ... including what Yeshua will necessarily have done to the enemy of our soul in the short term (lasting 1000 years) and then after that.

oh well, our and it's life, our and it's choice, yes ?

Perhaps it hopes to be able to demand a trial by combat ?



Yup, thanks to that wonderful and awful gift called "free will" war can even happen in heaven. Deem "thy will be done" included ...

Anyhoo, where were we. Oh yeah, there is you presumably choosing to ignore or be ignorant of all that our Creator has to say re: Israel and pretending that the Israel that was born-again in 1948 has nothing to do with any of the promises recorded in the bible. That it is just another place, just another ethnic group and would smell just as sweet or whatever if it were not called Israel.

Obviously your Joo Janta 200 Super-Chromatic Peril Sensitive Sunglasses are in full opaque in order for you to faithfully maintain such a patently illogical / incredible view.

oh well, "your life, your choice". It would be remiss of me though if I didn't pass on the following warning about preferring darkness to light ...

For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life. 17“For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world, but that the world might be saved through Him. 18“He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. 19“This is the judgment, that the Light has come into the world, and men loved the darkness rather than the Light, for their deeds were evil. 20“For everyone who does evil hates the Light, and does not come to the Light for fear that his deeds will be exposed. 21“But he who practices the truth comes to the Light, so that his deeds may be manifested as having been wrought in God.”

You can trust it to be accurate because it is from the same source that continually has made promises about Israel / the Children of Israel that have come to pass.

regarDS

 

[derspatz]

May I draw your attention to the fact that 50% of the Gazan population is 14 or younger? If Israel were targeting Palestinians indiscriminately, wouldn’t you expect the number of people under 14 who died to make up 50% of total casualties? Wouldn’t female casualties equal male casualties, given that males and females make up roughly 50% of the population each?

The fact is the majority of deaths have occurred in the 18-28 male group, consistent with them being most likely to be doing the fighting. The next largest group is of men aged 29-38, again what you would expect in a war. A full 61,5% of all deaths fall into those two male age groups. 10.8% have been aged 0-10.

So, can we please stop with all the faux facts about the large number of children dying? Any child’s death should give us pause to consider what has been lost and the grief and sadness that follow. But using those deaths to paint a false picture of Israeli disproportionality is just sick.

... and then there is the grisly fact that in comparison to the fatalities in Gaza and Israel since Hamas murdered those three Israel school kids, far more families/women/kids were drowned at sea / dashed upon the rocks thanks to the likes of KRudd, fabian socialist emily lister Gillard, and the greenazis throwing open our borders so Oz could be taken advantage of by economic opportunists and religious nuts hell-bent on creating a beachhead for their chosen form of totalitarianism.

Anyhoo, another day and another 250 murders of children in the womb committed in Oz ...

So, re: this whole PvI thang, perhaps Oz should be working on taking the beam out of its own eye first ?

regarDS

 

[Consuela]

The existence of Israel could also be a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Just saying.

 

[derspatz]

The existence of Israel could also be a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Just saying.

Heh. I can hardly wait for the usual suspects to latch onto that. Looking forward for the excuse to bring Revelation chapter 13 into things.

BTW, are we all ready for August the 1st ? Everyone got their pin numbers ?

anyhoo, back to enjoying reading a whole bunch of facts about the history of Israel, here: http://www.thewhyman.jesusanswers.com/custom4_2.html

They include these ...

Fact Number 39

Israel today is a modern-day miracle that has emerged because of hard work on the part of the Jewish people and God's prophetic blessing.

The only true democracy in the Middle East, Israel boasts a vibrant electoral system with dozens of political parties representing a variety of political views, from conservative to liberal Arab, secular to ultra-Orthodox Jewish.

Israel boasts an educational system that has given her citizens the highest literacy rate in the world; a medical system that provides guaranteed health care for all citizens and is sought after even by her enemies who arrive via neutral countries for treatment; a welfare system that provides goods and services to all in need - Jew and Arab alike; an agricultural system that changed a barren, deforested land of desert and swamp into a lush and prosperous region that has made Israel one of the world's food exporting nations; an army which is a defence force that has been evaluated as the fourth most efficient army in the world.

Its main industries are still tourism and agriculture. However, high technology is now the largest revenue industry, creating everything from new computer designs and development of hardware and software, to advanced medical and agricultural technology. Israel has now surpassed the US's Silicon Valley for high tech development.

The influx of immigrants into Israel from over 100 nations has given her a research and development (R&D) edge, since each nation has a different way of looking at a problem. With R&D teams made up of scientists and researchers from such varied locales as the former Soviet Union, the USA, India, S. America, S. Africa, and Europe, all working on a problem, innovative products are being brought to the market almost daily.

Israel is known as an innovative nation. Just tell an Israeli something can't be done, and he will figure out how to do it.



Fact Number 40

God is in control and His Word will be fulfilled regarding Israel, the Jewish people, His Church and the anticipated soon arrival of Messiah. As in the days of the Old Testament, even when it looks like all hope is lost and Israel will be vanquished, God has made a way, and showed forth His glory.

It is said of the Lord, "He that keeps Israel will not slumber nor sleep" (Ps. 121:4). Let us be participants with God in this prophetic move. Let us pray for Israel and for the peace of Jerusalem. Only God's peace will be a lasting peace.

In this article, we have covered the entirety of Israel's history from the days of Abraham to date. (Excluding the Hezbollah and current conflicts with the proven distortions, fabrications and other anti-Israel propaganda that the media would have the general public believe. This is a separate article in itself. Though I strongly recommend this site.)

I hope this information has helped you to realize the importance of this land to God and His Covenant people, the Jewish people. While other religions, including Christianity, place significance to this land, it is because of the covenants God made with His People Israel so many thousands of years ago. He is faithful to fulfil His promises recorded in His Word, the Bible.

regarDS

 

[Sweetgeek]

 

[Jam]

Anyway.... In other news.....

http://www.vice.com/en_au/read/what-google-trends-can-tell-us-about-australia?utm_source=vicefbanz

That is truly hilarious! And more than a little frightening.

 

[Connoisseur]

If a male politician said on the radio that he wanted a girlfriend who was good at house keeping and was nice and tight. Would you think that acceptable and fine?

Yep, double standards exist that's true and I'd argue that in this feminized modern age the majority favour women.

 

[derspatz]

Well, that's just sikh ... and deem "Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto" included anyway

Anyhoo, considering how prolly every human who has ever been born and who has also managed to rub a couple of thought cells together has decided for themselves what "being human" is and it rarely resembling what the next thought cell rubber considered it to be, and considering that virtually every conception involving a human sperm and a human egg produces "a human" (regardless of when what is conceived actually dies) has your chosen guru actually conveyed anything useful let alone anything that could be considered sage / wise ?

Surely Frank Sinatra gave us something far more useful when he sung "do, be, do, be, do", yes ?



All that said, your guru does appear to have said the odd useful and amusing thing ... and had a qool way of trolling muslims / women haters.

http://www.theworldofgurunanak.com/guru-nanak-dev-ji.html

regarDS

 

[Sweetgeek]

Well, that's just sikh ... and deem "Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto" included anyway

Anyhoo, considering how prolly every human who has ever been born and who has also managed to rub a couple of thought cells together has decided for themselves what "being human" is and it rarely resembling what the next thought cell rubber considered it to be, and considering that virtually every conception involving a human sperm and a human egg produces "a human" (regardless of when what is conceived actually dies) has your chosen guru actually conveyed anything useful let alone anything that could be considered sage / wise ?

Surely Frank Sinatra gave us something far more useful when he sung "do, be, do, be, do", yes ?

View attachment 40439

All that said, your guru does appear to have said the odd useful and amusing thing ... and had a qool way of trolling muslims / women haters.

http://www.theworldofgurunanak.com/guru-nanak-dev-ji.html

regarDS

No idea who the person is that quoted that, I only liked the quote. One thing I gained from your post- know who you are quoting. I'll take note next time

 

[derspatz]

No idea who the person is that quoted that, I only liked the quote. One thing I gained from your post- know who you are quoting. I'll take note next time

No worries.

BTW, why do you like that quote ... and have you ever met anyone who not only wasn't a human but also ceased to be a human upon choosing to become a card carrying member of any particular array of clubs or sects or cults or professions or hair colours or space programs or whatever ?

No ?

In which case, presumably you must like the quote for the level of nonsense it contains ?

In which case, perhaps you might also enjoy the following ?




regarDS

 

[Sweetgeek]

No worries.

BTW, why do you like that quote ... and have you ever met anyone who not only wasn't a human but also ceased to be a human upon choosing to become a card carrying member of any particular array of clubs or sects or cults or professions or hair colours or space programs or whatever ?

No ?

In which case, presumably you must like the quote for the level of nonsense it contains ?

In which case, perhaps you might also enjoy the following ?

View attachment 40440


regarDS

The way you read the quote is not the way I've read the quote. The quote to me means that people (maybe such as yourself ) will view things in life or side with certain things depending on their faith. So the point of the quote was that before you proclaim a faith you believe in, view everyone in the same light and share your compassion with everyone regardless of faith choice. Maybe the quote is to basic for you to have understood my reasons for liking it, but that's why I liked it. And what this means? I think you do have compassion for people, but whether you will share it, will depend on your ideas about certain groups of people.

Your mocking me I see, and not sure what your desired outcome was, but it's rather amusing, because I did in fact find that fish pic somewhat funny.

 

[Sweetgeek]

It's not really 'news', but I enjoyed reading it.

http://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/re...oor-in-australia/story-fnixwvgh-1227007328670