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Martin Place evacuated, hostages held at Lindt Cafe

davidftw said:
I don't mind the debate and discussion here because the mainstream media is certainly only allowing a particular view on this. I'd like to know why the police who we pay to protect us didn't end it sooner in a more definitive manner. If this had occurred in Britain or the USA we would not be looking at civilian casualties, we would be looking at one dead gunman taken down swiftly by a sharpshooter. If Channel 7 had a clear visual on this guy, the police must have. You need to read the media with an open mind and ask questions, because it is the version they want to feed you.
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They were always going to end it in the early hours of the morning

Adrenalin would have worn off, sleep deprived and slow reaction speeds meant that the police would have had a tactical advantage.

And of course in the middle of night helps when you have NVGs
 
Kaz said:
Actually they weren't, the police stated they were expecting it to last for days.
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Lol never

Having an armed gunman hold up in the CBD of Sydney for days was never going to happen

The public and pollies would have demanded it end with 24 hours
 
It couldn't possibly last for days with just one gunman. They would have known that fact the minute the first hostage escaped.
 
staceysmom said:
Anyone who needs a book to tell them how to behave is an idiot.
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So be critical of EVERY religion then. Be consistent.

staceysmom said:
Be kind, etc because that's who you are... not because a magical man in the sky told you so or because it'll get you into heaven.
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We all make mistakes sometimes. It is those who have religion who are consistently genuine in their apologies because of the belief of heaven.

staceysmom said:
I suspect the people who bend over backwards to defend Islam would never do the same for Christianity.
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I suspect the people who bend over backwards to attack Islam would never do the same for Christianity.

staceysmom said:
Oh, and remember this in Sydney?
behead-all-those-who-insult-the-prophet1.jpg
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paul-walker-westboro-baptist-church-funeral.jpg
 
Kaz said:
It wasn't a terror attack.

This loony wanted everyone to believe Muslims were behind it & to make people panic.

I saw people being interviewed & some of them where saying Muslims shouldn't be in Australia etc. (just shows how fucking stupid some Australians are)
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Look I think this is getting into debates about semantics and that's probably not helpful, especially today.

But I will say that most Muslims would also denounce Al Qaeda however we freely call them a terrorist organisation. Just because this man didn't work with a larger cell, does not take away from the fact that he was using violence for political or ideological gain. In my mind, that makes this certainly a terror attack. Just an individual terror attack.

@Trala - I have Islamic family members and my best friend also. There is no way that I would take the actions of this one crazy man as a reflection of the intentions or dispositions of everyone from an Islamic background.

In the end, it doesn't matter what we call it. It's a horrible, disgusting thing to happen and my thoughts and prayers are with all the hostages and their loved ones as they recover from this terrorising day and especially for the families and loved ones of the hostages who did not make it. Also for the police and service men and women who did as best they could yesterday.
 
The package at DFAT has now been deemed 'non-suspicious'

“The package was a backpack that had been accidentally left there by a staff member,” Station Sergeant Donna Hofmeir told reporters.

“There was nothing suspicious about it apart from the fact it was unattended.”

Sergeant Hofmeir said the owner of the backpack was “extremely embarrassed”.

“It was just a mistake that she’s left it there.”

She admitted that people were jittery after the siege in Sydney, but denied there needed to be a review.
 
bleachy_dude said:
Look I think this is getting into debates about semantics and that's probably not helpful, especially today.

But I will say that most Muslims would also denounce Al Qaeda however we freely call them a terrorist organisation. Just because this man didn't work with a larger cell, does not take away from the fact that he was using violence for political or ideological gain. In my mind, that makes this certainly a terror attack. Just an individual terror attack.

@Trala - I have Islamic family members and my best friend also. There is no way that I would take the actions of this one crazy man as a reflection of the intentions or dispositions of anyone from an Islamic background.

In the end, it doesn't matter what we call it. It's a horrible, disgusting thing to happen and my thoughts and prayers are with all the hostages and their loved ones as they recover from this terrorising day and especially for the families and loved ones of the hostages who did not make it. Also for the police and service men and women who did as best they could yesterday.
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I think an open dialog and debate is most helpful on a day like today.

Racism exists. Extrimist Islamic terrorists exist. Conversations like this often make people find out that what they thought to be 100% true in the way they think is in actual fact flawed. Terrorists need ignorance to survive just as racists need ignorance to survive. I believe conversations like the one we have seen Con, UAN and Beardymac share are really helpful in breaking down the barriers of ignorance.

I actually reflected on what you said and I disagree completely with Kaz. You're right. It is a terror attack plain and simple. Those people where sitting in terror and they were attacked.

You really are a beautiful man. By the looks this situation is not going to splinter us as a nation through judgement and hate, it is making us unify with compassion and love.

Aussie's rock!!!!!

In saying that I have deleted one facebook friend today. Any racist hate filled posts in my feed = instant delete.

#illridewithyou
 
Trala said:
I think an open dialog and debate is most helpful on a day like today.

Racism exists. Extrimist Islamic terrorists exist. Conversations like this often make people find out that what they thought to be 100% true in the way they think is in actual fact flawed. Terrorists need ignorance to survive just as racists need ignorance to survive. I believe conversations like the one we have seen Con, UAN and Beardymac share are really helpful in breaking down the barriers of ignorance.

I actually reflected on what you said and I disagree completely with Kaz. You're right. It is a terror attack plain and simple. Those people where sitting in terror and they were attacked.

You really are a beautiful man. By the looks this situation is not going to splinter us as a nation through judgement and hate, it is making us unify with compassion and love.

Aussie's rock!!!!!

In saying that I have deleted one facebook friend today. Any racist hate filled posts in my feed = instant delete.

#illridewithyou
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Absolutely. Open dialogue is so important. I just didn't want to get into a back and forth about labelling.

I think the #illridewithyou viral hashtag was something beautiful out of a disgusting thing. Beauty from ashes. It gives hope that we can come together as a nation and move forward to a brighter future together.

For the most part, I was impressed by the media yesterday also in the way that they hid this man's name so that he never got to see that his name was promoted and his demands were as hidden as best they could.

There have been some unhelpful comments in mainstream media but I have been fairly impressed with most of the balanced and fair coverage. I have mostly watched ABC news, with some flicking between Ten and Seven.
 
I found out yesterday and today I have some amazing friends on facebook. The posts I read and the way they were standing up for each other as well as people they do not know was inspiring. One friend I have who is Palestinian was so shocked by the display she actually posted she was speechless and so humbled by the love she saw. It took a small act of kindness like that to make a difference for her. I am really proud how so many didn't let the event of yesterday divide them, but rather come together as human beings.
 
davidftw said:
I don't mind the debate and discussion here because the mainstream media is certainly only allowing a particular view on this. I'd like to know why the police who we pay to protect us didn't end it sooner in a more definitive manner. If this had occurred in Britain or the USA we would not be looking at civilian casualties, we would be looking at one dead gunman taken down swiftly by a sharpshooter. If Channel 7 had a clear visual on this guy, the police must have. You need to read the media with an open mind and ask questions, because it is the version they want to feed you and so much is suppressed.
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They thought he had a bomb on person, right?
 
By the way, I agree with whoever said they would go down and have a coffee at Lindt in a heartbeat.

No gawking necessary. A sign that these kinda of acts will NOT strike terror into our lives indefinitely.
 
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bleachy_dude said:
Absolutely. Open dialogue is so important. I just didn't want to get into a back and forth about labelling.

I think the #illridewithyou viral hashtag was something beautiful out of a disgusting thing. Beauty from ashes. It gives hope that we can come together as a nation and move forward to a brighter future together.

For the most part, I was impressed by the media yesterday also in the way that they hid this man's name so that he never got to see that his name was promoted and his demands were as hidden as best they could.

There have been some unhelpful comments in mainstream media but I have been fairly impressed with most of the balanced and fair coverage. I have mostly watched ABC news, with some flicking between Ten and Seven.
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I think where there is respectful discussion, there is a golden opportunity to learn and grow.

In reality we do label, we do stereotype, we do assume. A back and forth discussion can be helpful in both dispelling myths and looking at a situation from another perspective.

I think this is the perfect thread and perfect day to do that.

I am really sad some fabulous posts which articulated how different people are processing this horrific situation were removed. When we know better, we do better. I think an open discussion empowers people. We need to reflect and discuss the situation to grow and move forward, I am not sure why some posters feel the need to try and censor that.
 
My thoughts are with the deceased hostages and their families, friends and loved ones. I also hope for speedy recovery for the hostages that sustained bullet wounds during the ordeal.

I am amazed that this guy was on bail, though it appears that the case against him for being an accessory to murder was classed by the magistrate to be a "weak" one, hence him being on bail.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...781538379?nk=c9fcc1c3e5b761018f9f2a0bd8ecbb78

Magistrate Darryl Pearce said there were significant flaws in the Crown's case against the pair.

"It is a weak case,'' he said.

Each of the accused had an alibi, the witness statements varied significantly, they didn't have anywhere else to go and they weren't a threat to the public, the magistrate said.

"If there is a threat it was to this woman who was murdered.''
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The turning point for his actions yesterday is likely to have been his failed last appeal to the high court on the Friday before the incident yesterday.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-12-...s-numerous-court-appearances-revealed/5970678

Last Friday the High Court threw his last attempt at an appeal out.
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How we deal with this kind of thing in the future - foreseeing such potential to commit such acts - is beyond me.
 
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