brief description of the Turkey slap Please?
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THE BUTTERFLY EFFECT: Who would have won if...
- Thread starter the Theorist
- Start date
So IF Lawson had gone in "newly single" instead with a GF does his hook up with Cat still doom him?
Connoisseur
Well-Known Member
You haven't found anything on google?
From what I can recall two male housemates got up at around 2 - 3 am to play a prank on girl called Camilla who was asleep in one of the bedrooms. Unfortunately I believe they were still a bit intoxicated from the night before and thought it would be riot to rub their male reproductive appendages on her face whilst she was sleeping. The rest as they say is history.
Yikes!!that makes the BBUS racism tame in comparison , or not
I
I keep forgetting about Google and now I am horrified
Anastasia Beaverhausen
I got a fake laugh with your name all over it.
I don't think so, but his nice guy magician persona was wearing off anyway. Lawson could be obnoxious and grumpy, so even though he would have made it further he still wouldn't have won.
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He IS attractive, and very much so!!!
It's interesting what you're saying about 'wingman' style relationships. There have been a number of pairings (non-romantic) over the years where the relationship between 2 housemates provided more value than either housemate individually:
-Ben & Blair
-Nathan & Sahra
-Dan & Chrissie (best 'wingmen' ever IMO)
-Reggie & Kim
-Paul & Fryzie
-Tim & Vesna
-Ben & Stacy
-Michael & Josh
-Tim & Boog
-Tim & Drew
-Caleb & Matt tried hard but both were too bland to be of any value as a 'pair'
-Sam & Sandy would have had potential if we'd had uncut and been able to see their crass humour
Haha good post still, but yeah - I think a lot of you are straying from the original theory though.
What I mean is, Bree's incorrect eviction, the turkey slap and the death of Josh's brother were the only three moments in BBAU that literally disrupted the timeline and altered the natural flow of events both in the house and in the production of the show after them (Merlin's eviction protest is an addition to this theory, however it had no effect inside the house as it did on the outside so is excluded).
These incidents were unexpected, all disrupted the production of the show in some way and were as real and unpredictable as reality TV can get. That's why I specifically named these three events as causing such a significant impact on their respective seasons and/or the rest of the series itself.
Any other events (like "if so-and-so didn't form a relationship", etc) don't really fall into this theory as they're simply regular occurrences that happen as part of the natural course of events in the house, which rightfully shouldn't be changed imo.
Wow what tools! Were John and Camilla hooking up?
Afflllate
Well-Known Member
Another one would possibly be Belinda becoming the first to voluntarily walk in 2003 IMO. It was breaking news stuff in 2002 when Turkan threatened it but never followed through (ended up evicted within the next two weeks or so anyhow).
Remember also this was coming off the back of the whole 'Belindagate' saga and from what I remember there was this general level of tension after that in the square house then once the merge happened she was just basically unhappy, I think this was also around the time Ben and Chrissie had their blow up and Ben wasn't mr popular in particular and Belinda decided she'd had enough.
Ben ended up getting evicted that week anyway (Belinda was also nominated, and I think she'd been up every single week to that point).
I think things could have maybe been different if a) Belindagate never happened, which set in motion the increased alienation of Belinda and/or b) if Ben was still being an ass post-merge of the houses and being a main cause of disharmony, if Belinda had decided to stay.
We had seen her become close with Reggie during the temporary hm swap, and I think Jo as well. Her relationship with the other square hms mightve been better also without Belindagate.
Had she stayed however the thing is would she have lasted longer or been evicted anyway a few more evictions down the line. She may have begun to start a bit of underdog support going in the face of being outcast ala Camilla or Estelle, but even so if Ben had still been evicted that week a lot of that issue may have been lifted and we may have seen her start to enjoy herself a bit more and show more of herself and may have started getting a reprieve from nominations in the later weeks.
What do you guys think?
Remember also this was coming off the back of the whole 'Belindagate' saga and from what I remember there was this general level of tension after that in the square house then once the merge happened she was just basically unhappy, I think this was also around the time Ben and Chrissie had their blow up and Ben wasn't mr popular in particular and Belinda decided she'd had enough.
Ben ended up getting evicted that week anyway (Belinda was also nominated, and I think she'd been up every single week to that point).
I think things could have maybe been different if a) Belindagate never happened, which set in motion the increased alienation of Belinda and/or b) if Ben was still being an ass post-merge of the houses and being a main cause of disharmony, if Belinda had decided to stay.
We had seen her become close with Reggie during the temporary hm swap, and I think Jo as well. Her relationship with the other square hms mightve been better also without Belindagate.
Had she stayed however the thing is would she have lasted longer or been evicted anyway a few more evictions down the line. She may have begun to start a bit of underdog support going in the face of being outcast ala Camilla or Estelle, but even so if Ben had still been evicted that week a lot of that issue may have been lifted and we may have seen her start to enjoy herself a bit more and show more of herself and may have started getting a reprieve from nominations in the later weeks.
What do you guys think?
blackandcrimson
Reality Tragic, Tragically Real
Those two were the aggressive alpha males in the house that year, walking over everyone with an entitled attitude. One of them (can't remember which one) actually said they could do anything they liked in there and no one could stop them. I believe the other HMs were a bit afraid of them, but would not nominate them, wanting to be liked by the dominant males.and as they were a gang of two, they were intimidating. They were absolute tools, who destroyed their lives by their own actions. They were on the news, and in the papers and magazines for ages after. I actually feel no sympathy for either, as they were both spoilt brats and their families tried to make out they were set up.
It was no secret Camilla wanted to hook up with any male. First was David, until he came out as gay. Then it was get on the alpha males good side so they would notice her. That was why she didn't protest too much when it happened. Can't dob in the top guys and still be in their favour.
Fans watching the live feed (as available then) were the ones who brought to everyone's attention. Ch 10 deleted the vision very quickly, but the people who were recording it put it out and let the world know what had happened. And the rest is history.
An excellent post @the Theorist.
At the time I am typing this response, I have only the first page of replies to this thread, so sorry if I mention something that's already discussed on the next few pages.
2004 is hard to say. I really depends on whether Bree making the final 2 was a result of her fake eviction. It's hard to know because we don't know exactly why people voted. If the final 2 had been Trevor/Paul, Trevor/Fitzy or Paul/Fitzy, who would have taken it in each scenario.
I completely agree that the 2006 Turkey slap incident completely changed the course of the following BB seasons.
-As a result of the controversy generated by Turkey slap, the 2007 season was much more fluffy/fake/nice housemates.
-As a result of the fluffy 07 season. BB was criticised and suffered a drop in ratings from its previous year.
-As a result of the failed 07 season, Kyle and ?Jackie O were brought in a host a more lively 08 season.
-As a result of the changes made in 08, BB was axed that year.
This then led to BB being reincarnated 4 years later on Nine. So the Turkey slap had set a chain reaction, which has led to the BB we just saw this year.
If you want to go deeper into it. You could argue that the Turkey slap also had a much wider impact on Australian TV. If Big Brother had never been axed in 2008, then Ten wouldn't have commissioned Masterchef as a replacement. Masterchef went on to become one of the most successful shows in Australian TV history, and killed off several shows on Seven and Nine in ratings. Also, My Kitchen Rules was commissioned as a copy of Masterchef, so without Masterchef being commissioned, MKR would not exist. MKR is now Seven's top show and has been for 3 years running.
As for BB 2012, you'd have at the next 2 nomination weeks. After Josh walked, there were only 2 more rounds of nominations before the final week. Let's assume Angie had been evicted that week instead of Josh. Out of the remaining contestants, Sam and Zoe would have probably been the weakest in a public vote. However, would they have been nominated in the final 2 weeks?
Throughout 2012, the cool group of ?Michael, Josh, Benjamin, Layla, Stacey and Zoe had rarely/never been nominated. Angie, Sam and Estelle were the misfits who kept getting nominated. With Angie gone, there would only be two misfits left, so at least one cool kid would have to be nominated the following week. Let's not forget, Angie would have most likely given Layla the superpower, and Layla would have used it to try and keep herself and Sam safe. That would mean that at least two of the cool group had to be up.
With Layla having the power, I will assume she would survive the next round of noms and that Estelle would be up, because she always is.
My prediction would be:
SCENARIO ONE: If Layla was unsuccessful in saving Sam, Sam would have gone home. As he had the smallest fanbase.
This would have tipped the numbers balance in favour of the Benjamin group. Even though Layla would have got the superpower in the final week, I don't know if it would have been enough to change the outcome. I think ?Michael/Josh/Ben would have survived the final week of NOMs. Stacey and the three boys would have nominated Estelle, Layla and maybe Zoe. Zoe and Estelle would both have nommed Stacey, so depending on how the points ended up, Layla might have used the power to try and put Stacey/Zoe/Estelle up, while saving herself. I think Layla and Stella would survived a vote regardless of that outcome. If Zoe had been nominated, she probably would have gone home. If it was Stacey/Layla/Estelle, then Stacey would have been the most likely, purely based on previous on previous voting patters. In any case, I say Zoe and Stacey would have got 6th and 7th. The rest is a total guess, but I'll go Ben and Layla for 4th and 5th, with Estelle/Josh/Michael finale.
SCENARIO TWO: (After Angie's eviction) If Layla succeeded in saving Sam, and Zoe got nominated against Estelle and one other cool group person, then Zoe would have gone, as she had the next smallest fanbase. Zoe would likely given the superpower to one of the cool group (prob Ben), which would have resulted in Sam and Estelle being nommed in the final round of nominations. I don't know who the third person would have been, but I think Sam would have been evicted regardless. For the final week, I would put Stacey in 6th place. So then I'd be back to the same final 5 I had in scenario one, and would be guessing from then on.
SCENARIO THREE-If Layla was able to save Sam, and Zoe also survived, then it would be Estelle 2 of either Michael/Josh/Ben/Stacey. I think if Stacey was up, then she would have gone, given her SP to Ben. Sam would have got nommed and evicted the following week. Zoe would have come 6th, then I'm back to my final 5 from the previous 2 scenarios.
SCENARIO FOUR-This is the only scenario that doesn't bring me to the same five people. If Layla had succeeded in saving Sam, and both Stacey and Zoe surviving NOMs, that would pit Estelle against 2 of either Michael, Josh and Ben. I have no idea who would have been booted in that scenario.
At the time I am typing this response, I have only the first page of replies to this thread, so sorry if I mention something that's already discussed on the next few pages.
2004 is hard to say. I really depends on whether Bree making the final 2 was a result of her fake eviction. It's hard to know because we don't know exactly why people voted. If the final 2 had been Trevor/Paul, Trevor/Fitzy or Paul/Fitzy, who would have taken it in each scenario.
I completely agree that the 2006 Turkey slap incident completely changed the course of the following BB seasons.
-As a result of the controversy generated by Turkey slap, the 2007 season was much more fluffy/fake/nice housemates.
-As a result of the fluffy 07 season. BB was criticised and suffered a drop in ratings from its previous year.
-As a result of the failed 07 season, Kyle and ?Jackie O were brought in a host a more lively 08 season.
-As a result of the changes made in 08, BB was axed that year.
This then led to BB being reincarnated 4 years later on Nine. So the Turkey slap had set a chain reaction, which has led to the BB we just saw this year.
If you want to go deeper into it. You could argue that the Turkey slap also had a much wider impact on Australian TV. If Big Brother had never been axed in 2008, then Ten wouldn't have commissioned Masterchef as a replacement. Masterchef went on to become one of the most successful shows in Australian TV history, and killed off several shows on Seven and Nine in ratings. Also, My Kitchen Rules was commissioned as a copy of Masterchef, so without Masterchef being commissioned, MKR would not exist. MKR is now Seven's top show and has been for 3 years running.
As for BB 2012, you'd have at the next 2 nomination weeks. After Josh walked, there were only 2 more rounds of nominations before the final week. Let's assume Angie had been evicted that week instead of Josh. Out of the remaining contestants, Sam and Zoe would have probably been the weakest in a public vote. However, would they have been nominated in the final 2 weeks?
Throughout 2012, the cool group of ?Michael, Josh, Benjamin, Layla, Stacey and Zoe had rarely/never been nominated. Angie, Sam and Estelle were the misfits who kept getting nominated. With Angie gone, there would only be two misfits left, so at least one cool kid would have to be nominated the following week. Let's not forget, Angie would have most likely given Layla the superpower, and Layla would have used it to try and keep herself and Sam safe. That would mean that at least two of the cool group had to be up.
With Layla having the power, I will assume she would survive the next round of noms and that Estelle would be up, because she always is.
My prediction would be:
SCENARIO ONE: If Layla was unsuccessful in saving Sam, Sam would have gone home. As he had the smallest fanbase.
This would have tipped the numbers balance in favour of the Benjamin group. Even though Layla would have got the superpower in the final week, I don't know if it would have been enough to change the outcome. I think ?Michael/Josh/Ben would have survived the final week of NOMs. Stacey and the three boys would have nominated Estelle, Layla and maybe Zoe. Zoe and Estelle would both have nommed Stacey, so depending on how the points ended up, Layla might have used the power to try and put Stacey/Zoe/Estelle up, while saving herself. I think Layla and Stella would survived a vote regardless of that outcome. If Zoe had been nominated, she probably would have gone home. If it was Stacey/Layla/Estelle, then Stacey would have been the most likely, purely based on previous on previous voting patters. In any case, I say Zoe and Stacey would have got 6th and 7th. The rest is a total guess, but I'll go Ben and Layla for 4th and 5th, with Estelle/Josh/Michael finale.
SCENARIO TWO: (After Angie's eviction) If Layla succeeded in saving Sam, and Zoe got nominated against Estelle and one other cool group person, then Zoe would have gone, as she had the next smallest fanbase. Zoe would likely given the superpower to one of the cool group (prob Ben), which would have resulted in Sam and Estelle being nommed in the final round of nominations. I don't know who the third person would have been, but I think Sam would have been evicted regardless. For the final week, I would put Stacey in 6th place. So then I'd be back to the same final 5 I had in scenario one, and would be guessing from then on.
SCENARIO THREE-If Layla was able to save Sam, and Zoe also survived, then it would be Estelle 2 of either Michael/Josh/Ben/Stacey. I think if Stacey was up, then she would have gone, given her SP to Ben. Sam would have got nommed and evicted the following week. Zoe would have come 6th, then I'm back to my final 5 from the previous 2 scenarios.
SCENARIO FOUR-This is the only scenario that doesn't bring me to the same five people. If Layla had succeeded in saving Sam, and both Stacey and Zoe surviving NOMs, that would pit Estelle against 2 of either Michael, Josh and Ben. I have no idea who would have been booted in that scenario.
True but she got most saved in week 2 despite minimal screen time compared to Katie, Travis and Priya (who she was up against).
YES! YES! YES!
I effing love your whole post, omg. Especially the bit I quoted above.
You nailed the true effect of a "Butterfly Effect" on the head!
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Mooseface
Little known member
Ah, this thread is for the real analytical BB die-hards, isn't it?! I don't have additions to the analysis really, because my memory isn't sooo great in the specifics, but I do just want to post my appreciation for the topic and I have enjoyed reading the posts. And re watching the you tube clips posted re the turkey slap and berlin das walking. It is no wonder I got addictd to the show - I hadn't quite realised just how much the format had changed until I re watched the conversations between Chrissie and Ben, John and Vince, Reggie and Chrissie and re watched the reaction to John and Ashley being sent home. They were much much rawer. They showed whole conversations and unmanufactured honest emotional responses. People actually transformed through the experience.
I had forgotten Belinda walked although it definitely seems historic now, and as though it never happened when I think back to Nathan last year. And I don't remember Belinda-gate either, or whatever the threats of harm were about (did Belinda threaten someone? Or threaten to harm herself?)
And I entirely agree Chrissie and Dan were the best wingmen pairing ever - but where WAS Dan in the 'Belinda' episode. I didn't even see him? Or I completely missed it plus have recalled what he looked like completely wrongly.
Fascinating. Keep the theories coming, @theorist!!
I had forgotten Belinda walked although it definitely seems historic now, and as though it never happened when I think back to Nathan last year. And I don't remember Belinda-gate either, or whatever the threats of harm were about (did Belinda threaten someone? Or threaten to harm herself?)
And I entirely agree Chrissie and Dan were the best wingmen pairing ever - but where WAS Dan in the 'Belinda' episode. I didn't even see him? Or I completely missed it plus have recalled what he looked like completely wrongly.
Fascinating. Keep the theories coming, @theorist!!
Columbo
Never again
Don't you mean Tim and Greg Logan in BB05?
These are the kind kind of guys that will never get why the rest of us r pissed at them
All
I can say to this is.... Wow every time you think you have an obsession issue, someone shows up to outdo you