Housemate #5 TULLY!

[littlebear]

Wow I've been watching BB for years, and enjoyed reading these forums for most of that time, but never before felt the need to go to the effort of creating an account here for what will likely be a one-time post.

It surprises me reading this thread and others what perfect, neat lives most people on here seem to privileged enough to have had as that isn't my experience of people I know in everyday life. I say this as I don't know how anyone who has actually lived through any kind of hurtful or traumatic experience could be so judgemental of others' methods of coping with them.

In the first weeks of the show I found myself identifying with (not necessarily liking) Tully, as my twenties were a time of great upheaval and family issues and I am also quite an emotional person. It isn't something I like about myself and is not attractive to watch exaggerated on TV in another person, but the fact that we cry when sad, frustrated, tired, hormonal, or otherwise stressed out is not an indication of our inner strength. I am not saying that I know Tully is stronger than people are painting her to be, but I also know for a fact that I have survived things that many have told me they could not go through. Yet in other situations I can seem an emotional flake.

With regards to the Drully situation - their initial affectionate friendship is entirely believable to me. When I was that age I was going through some of the hardest things I think I will ever have to, yet also having the time of my life with some of the best friends I will ever have. At that age friendships and love can feel so intense, particularly in my experience in groups of friends that spend a lot of time doing everything together. Throw in a party scene and the need to escape occasionally from the pressure of feeling you need to hold a family together and these friendships become intensified.

I know for a fact that my partner and I at the time hugged, kissed and cuddled all our friends all the time. We were all comfortable with each other physically as well as emotionally and the level of trust was extremely high and nothing ever happened that we would have construed as cheating, although reading this thread there are a lot of puritans who would have had us crucified for some of our actions. And no - we weren't swingers!

Drew and Tully are apparently both more craving of affection and emotional support than may be typical for some, a possible character flaw that I can identify with. They also seem to have a lot in common and an obvious chemistry. Put them in a contrived situation with no way to "touch base" with their own individual identities outside the house and I can see why they (like Jade's fixation on Ed) have ended up this way. There is no way for us to say if they are genuinely in love or not (I'm not sure there is ever a definitive test for this anyway), but the feelings are real for them. They'll only know how real once they are back outside and see each other living their real (though vastly changed now I'm sure!) lives and deal with the attention both positive and negative. As for Tully being some kind of evil cheating conniving liar - seriously??? This is one of the most heart-on-sleeve honest people on this show, and she's been living the whole thing on camera. She may not have conducted herself in a manner that you would approve of, but to put her on a par with someone who has been married and living a double life for years is just ridiculous. I certainly have sympathy for Tahlia, but shit happens and people fall in love whether it lasts or not. I wouldn't like watching the person I love fall in love with someone else on daily television with the world commenting, but to be honest I don't think I would like watching someone I love in the BB house at all!

The way I see it, there has to be some element of narcissism in everyone who applies to go on any kind of reality show, particularly one like this where you are entirely isolated from everything that makes you feel connected to your sense of self. (Sorry that was a really clunky sentence but I'm not sure how to say it clearly). I just find it bizarre when any housemate in particular is criticised for being attention-seeking, isn't every single one of them pretty much by definition?

Haha ok rant over. I do have to admit that though I can't watch people I despise (and there haven't been any this season, although Mikkayla really grates on me), I would much rather watch people who have depth, different dimensions, and psychologically interesting actions and reactions. This I choose over the pretty shiny plastic "nice" ones any day. If I wanted to watch fake-arse bland posers every night I'd watch Home and Away.

Chiming in late, but thank you for this fantastic first post. It makes me think we might share a brain, actually, but unfortunately for me, you got all the eloquent bits. Well thought out and well said, all of it.

 

[tconroy135]

Emotional cheating is considered cheating by the majority of people. Examples would be when you confide in another person instead of your partner and seek things from them you should be seeking from your partner. Many people consider emotional affairs worse than physical affairs.

I don't agree, but they have kissed and said I Love You! so it's a moot point

 

[littlebear]

Emotional cheating is considered cheating by the majority of people. Examples would be when you confide in another person instead of your partner...

Oh god, I'm a whore.

 

[LoveBB]

[MENTION=34034]LoveBB[/MENTION] I never said regarding Tahlia "she'll get over it". I did say shit happens, and stand by that. It most certainly does, and i don't think anyone would say shit hasn't happened here. It's sad for them, it must hurt, love is messy.

I don't claim to be superior or love people more than they love me. Although when I heard Tully say that I just felt sad for her.

I also don't have a particular view on who is right or wrong in this case, we have never had the benefit of observing Tully and Tahlia's relationship. I value honesty and loyalty more than most people I know - the last time I lied to avoid trouble was in 1993.

That is the difference between you and others. When I heard her say that I thought "needy, attention seeker, annoying, uggghhh".

Regarding the fact that you say you don't have an opinion on the Tully relationship saga... That is the opposite of what you said in your opening novel-length post. You had plenty of opinions in there...?? Why back down now?

 

[chads]

I don't agree, but they have kissed and said I Love You! so it's a moot point

Of course it's ok to confide in friends but the lines get blurred when the friend is opposite sex. In fact I'd say that is how the majority of affairs start. People start complaining about their partners or relationships to a "friend" or a co-worker.

 

[chads]

Oh god, I'm a whore.

If people seek emotional support from opposite sex friends or co-workers, what do they need their partner for?

 

[Meewa]

That is the difference between you and others. When I heard her say that I thought "needy, attention seeker, annoying, uggghhh".

Regarding the fact that you say you don't have an opinion on the Tully relationship saga... That is the opposite of what you said in your opening novel-length post. You had plenty of opinions in there...?? Why back down now?

Please don't pick small phrases from my "novel-length post" to push your agenda. I debate/argue to understand, not to win. Please, have a trophy.

 

[littlebear]

If people seek emotional support from opposite sex friends or co-workers, what do they need their partner for?

Are you serious? No one can be everything to another person. This is not the movies. And men and women can, in fact, be emotionally supportive friends to one another without banging, wanting to bang, or thinking about banging.

 

[LoveBB]

What a load of bullshit.

The way Tully and Drew have conducted themselves is beyond inappropriate. It's no longer merely an "affectionate friendship" and hasn't been that for weeks. Don't piss on my leg and tell me it's raining.

I'm sick of people trying to justify selfish actions by bringing the conversation back to themselves and their love life and their relationship and what's okay for them and blah blah blah. Guess what, what's okay for you isn't okay for other people. It wasn't okay for Tahlia, and hers is the only opinion that's relevant. Recognising cheating as cheating and calling a spade a spade isn't being sanctimonious or puritanical, you can kindly gtfo with that "logic".

I do love your direct approach des. Apparently for some people, Tully's actions and behaviours are all very much a ho hum normal part of life...no biggie...whatevs... Move on...shit happens... Meh.

And if you think otherwise, you must be living life as it looks on a cereal box (?)... Or you MUST be a bible basher!

 

[LoveBB]

Please don't pick small phrases from my "novel-length post" to push your agenda. I debate/argue to understand, not to win. Please, have a trophy.

To push what agenda? We are in a forum and you say you want to debate...I'm rebutting your contradictory statements and asking for you to explain.

 

[chads]

Are you serious? No one can be everything to another person. This is not the movies. And men and women can, in fact, be emotionally supportive friends to one another without banging, wanting to bang, or thinking about banging.

Are you saying that receiving the affection the partner should be giving from someone else is OK when in a relationship?

 

[littlebear]

Are you saying that receiving the affection the partner should be giving from someone else is OK when in a relationship?

Who said anything about affection that should come from a partner? We were talking about confiding in opposite-sex friends! You can't just swap in different arguments midstream.

 

[chads]

Who said anything about affection that should come from a partner? We were talking about confiding in opposite-sex friends! You can't just swap in different arguments midstream.

Affection and emotional support are basically the same thing when in a relationship. I'm not talking about normal day things chit chat. Do you think it's appropriate to talk about your sex life with opposite sex co-workers?

Btw. this is exactly what happened to Tully; she started confiding and seeking emotional support from Drew. And look at them now.

 

[littlebear]

Affection and emotional support are basically the same thing when in a relationship. I'm not talking about normal day things chit chat. Do you think it's appropriate to talk about your sex life with opposite sex co-workers?

Btw. this is exactly what happened to Tully; she started confiding and seeking emotional support from Drew. And look at them now.

I think it's entirely dependent on the nature of the relationship between the two friends. Or co-workers, since you seem to have narrowed the field to just co-workers for whatever reason. All friendships are not the same, and the boundaries for what's acceptable within relationships can vary and still be perfectly stable, strong, and healthy. I'm getting the impression that you have pretty rigid ideas about these things, and that's your prerogative, but it's just not my experience of the world.

 

[chads]

I think it's entirely dependent on the nature of the relationship between the two friends. Or co-workers, since you seem to have narrowed the field to just co-workers for whatever reason. All friendships are not the same, and the boundaries for what's acceptable within relationships can vary and still be perfectly stable, strong, and healthy. I'm getting the impression that you have pretty rigid ideas about these things, and that's your prerogative, but it's just not my experience of the world.

Co-worker was just an example. When do you think the line is crossed? Would you be ok with your wife secretly talking to me every day about your sex life and marital problems, texting me every day, morning and night besides seeing me 8 hours a day at work and going work lunch with me? Then when something bothering her came up she would call me instead of talking to you.

Do you disagree that Tully's affair started exactly from being friends then progressing to -> emotional affair -> physical affair? This is how most affairs start.

 

[LoveBB]

Co-worker was just an example. When do you think the line is crossed? Would you be ok with your wife secretly talking to me every day about your sex life and marital problems, texting me every day, morning and night besides seeing me 8 hours a day at work and going work lunch with me? Then when something bothering her came up she would call me instead of talking to you.

Do you disagree that Tully's affair started exactly from being friends then progressing to -> emotional affair -> physical affair? This is how most affairs start.

[MENTION=36011]chads[/MENTION]... I agree with your last paragraph. Tully initiated the relationship with Drew when she started putting negative ideas about Jade in Drew's head... She's using you, I'm worried about you... Then Tully took Jade's bed spot...then the passive agressive arguments...From then onwards it has grown into a codependent setup.

Boiling frog syndrome.

 

[littlebear]

Co-worker was just an example. When do you think the line is crossed? Would you be ok with your wife secretly talking to me every day about your sex life and marital problems, texting me every day, morning and night besides seeing me 8 hours a day at work and going work lunch with me? Then when something bothering her came up she would call me instead of talking to you.

Do you disagree that Tully's affair started exactly from being friends then progressing to -> emotional affair -> physical affair? This is how most affairs start.

A) You are exhausting. I mean this as both a compliment and not a compliment.

B) I'm actually female, with a male partner, but that's beside the point.

C) Of course there's a line. The depth of the emotional connection, the level of dependence on the friendship, the time spent together, all are factors. But you seemed to be drawing the line between acceptable and unacceptable at "confiding in opposite sex friends about your partner," full stop, and that's all I disagreed with. Within reason, of course, I think having a friendly, trustworthy opposite-sex perspective on things from someone other than your partner can be invaluable. Some couples aren't okay with that, some are. So yes, there is a line that should not be crossed, but it's not necessarily in the exact same place for every (perfectly healthy, decent, moral) couple.

D) No, I do not disagree that what you're saying is basically what happened with Tully and Drew. Yes, a lot of affairs start that way. I don't know if I'd say most, like, statistically, but who knows.

God I hope that covers it.

 

[Felicianah]

Are you serious? No one can be everything to another person. This is not the movies. And men and women can, in fact, be emotionally supportive friends to one another without banging, wanting to bang, or thinking about banging.

Agree. Although there is probably a teeny tiny amount of thinking about banging...

 

[chads]

A) You are exhausting. I mean this as both a compliment and not a compliment.

B) I'm actually female, with a male partner, but that's beside the point.

C) Of course there's a line. The depth of the emotional connection, the level of dependence on the friendship, the time spent together, all are factors. But you seemed to be drawing the line between acceptable and unacceptable at "confiding in opposite sex friends about your partner," full stop, and that's all I disagreed with. Within reason, of course, I think having a friendly, trustworthy opposite-sex perspective on things from someone other than your partner can be invaluable. Some couples aren't okay with that, some are. So yes, there is a line that should not be crossed, but it's not necessarily in the exact same place for every (perfectly healthy, decent, moral) couple.

D) No, I do not disagree that what you're saying is basically what happened with Tully and Drew. Yes, a lot of affairs start that way. I don't know if I'd say most, like, statistically, but who knows.

God I hope that covers it.

A) That's exactly what my girlfriend says in the bedroom.

Seriously, yes, I know I have very strong opinion on the subjects I discuss/argue. Many people don't like that I'm just used to say what I think and they instead start to concentrate on me as a person when they realize they can't change my opinion. But it's their problem not mine.

I'm aware every person has the boundaries set differently and it's ok with me as long as my partner has similar to mine. Others can do whatever they want with their relationships. If you ever find yourself in the unfortunate situation where you realize you have been cheated on and it started from a "harmless" friendship that was not set boundaries properly, please remember this discussion.

 

[littlebear]

If you ever find yourself in the unfortunate situation where you realize you have been cheated on and it started from a "harmless" friendship that was not set boundaries properly, please remember this discussion.

Been there, learned that, won't be forgetting it.