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Estelle and Michael kissed last night! Eww or Yew?

  • Thread starter Thread starter jordy_red
  • Start date Start date
Stop putting all the blame on Michael, I hardly think it's all Michael's fault. Notice when the scary noises started and Estelle ran straight for his bed? Oldest trick in the book. "Oooh I'm scared ... hold me". When girls like somebody they sometimes use little sneaky things like that as an excuse to get close lol.

And after all the scary stuff stopped ... she didn't go back to her own bed. Plus she was the one who asked if they could spoon together (a couple of days ago). So it's not all one-sided.

They get on ok now .... but it's NOT gonna be a big romance, I think they are just getting a bit of comfort and affection from each other while they are in the house. Nothing more nothing less.
 
pwta said:
They get on ok now .... but it's NOT gonna be a big romance, I think they are just getting a bit of comfort and affection from each other while they are in the house. Nothing more nothing less.
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The I HATE ESTELLE/I LOVE ESTELLE backflip happened the same day as the Ben/Michael Captain's Quarters moratorium of evil, where it was decided that the only reason estelle had such a big following was saved so many times was because of the way Ben/Michael and many others had bullied her.

Later that day QUE: Michael with his Estelle speech 'I really misunderstood her, she's a beautiful innocent person that wouldn't hurt a fly' blah blah blah, and now the Michael and Estelle romance. Michael is ruthlessly frightening in his machiavellian ruthless deception inorder to win the $250k.
As soon as he's won, Estelle will be yesterday's newspaper. I"ll admit though his manipulation of the TV voting audience is amazing, he's so deceptive I think he'd do just as well in the BB US house.
 
It's just so transparent.. to make it more believable he should have understated how he 'felt' a bit more. Saying "she is so genuine, and such a beautiful, wonderful person" or whatever it was he said is just over the top after previously saying she was the fakest human being he's ever met.

Layla's description of Estelle was more believable "Yes she can be weird and annoying but she is also just a nice person", probably because Layla meant it at the time. Layla even said her and Estelle would never be best friends - to me that stuff is far more believable than Michael's complete 180.
 
atropine said:
The I HATE ESTELLE/I LOVE ESTELLE backflip happened the same day as the Ben/Michael Captain's Quarters moratorium of evil, where it was decided that the only reason estelle had such a big following was saved so many times was because of the way Ben/Michael and many others had bullied her.

Later that day QUE: Michael with his Estelle speech 'I really misunderstood her, she's a beautiful innocent person that wouldn't hurt a fly' blah blah blah, and now the Michael and Estelle romance. Michael is ruthlessly frightening in his machiavellian ruthless deception inorder to win the $250k.
As soon as he's won, Estelle will be yesterday's newspaper. I"ll admit though his manipulation of the TV voting audience is amazing, he's so deceptive I think he'd do just as well in the BB US house.
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I think the only reason he can get away with it is with the help of BB. They love the "romance" angle this season. That has given any plan of his a giant push. If they ignored and didn't join in the flirting bullying of Estelle there'd be no anticipation for his plan. If they weren't running big things of, "the kiss" everywhere then it'd just be Michael tried to mack on. The editorial of the show is working a treat for Michael.
 
So if Michael is strategising, then maybe Estelle is too?

She is the one who has made all the first moves - wanting to spoon, running to his bed, staying in his bed. Maybe she realised Michael is also popular (with viewers) and decided to flirt with him to try and get some of his fans to like her.
 
pwta said:
So if Michael is strategising, then maybe Estelle is too?

She is the one who has made all the first moves - wanting to spoon, running to his bed, staying in his bed. Maybe she realised Michael is also popular (with viewers) and decided to flirt with him to try and get some of his fans to like her.
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No doubt the Estelle apologists will come at me with their verbal pitchforks, but I don't know if she's strategising so much as her sense of self is so defined by male attention that she needed the ego boost, and with Michael the only available male left, her choices were limited. And what better ego boost than to turn her number one 'enemy' in the house into her number one fan. I don't think she's stupid, that she wouldn't see that it's Michael's strategy now, but people's egos do get in the way of rational thought sometimes (Michael is a prime example).

You can tell by the conversation they had after the secrets thing where she said "I knew we should be friends!" that she feels vindicated now, that Michael has finally seen the light and her personality has received some positive reinforcement.
 
pwta said:
So if Michael is strategising, then maybe Estelle is too?

She is the one who has made all the first moves - wanting to spoon, running to his bed, staying in his bed. Maybe she realised Michael is also popular (with viewers) and decided to flirt with him to try and get some of his fans to like her.
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It's harder to tell with her as we haven't seen her speaking to anyone devising a strategy. I guess, what is her plan? Suck up to Michael to get votes? I don't know if his popularity and inevitable win is obvious in the house or not. He's been up for eviction once. Very few survived multiple evictions. They have no idea if he survived by 1% of 90%. I think if anything Stacey going would push the idea that group isn't that popular.

I guess we know for a fact Michael is playing the game and what it is. We don't quite know with her. I guess the fact the house is smaller, less people. The barrier to her being excluded is gone. It is entirely plausible she isn't. Although one has to assume she would be putting some thought into strategy. She did knock back the kiss though. So the romance angle seems to be some what ruled out.

She's hard to pin down. She's absolutely hated and sitting by herself. People say she's game playing. She makes friends, people say it's game playing.
 
up_all_night said:
She's hard to pin down. She's absolutely hated and sitting by herself. People say she's game playing. She makes friends, people say it's game playing.
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That's the bit that gets me. It doesn't matter what she does, they bitch about it and the rabid anti Estelle posters (I'm mostly talking about FB here) abuse her for it.
 
I think it is hard to say on either side. Being in the house would probably have people doing things they normally wouldn't do. There is very little stimulation, and everything is amplified e.g. if somebody does something that annoys you, it REALLY annoys you. So feelings are amplified, fights are amplified, friendships are amplified. It's just not the same as being in the real world.

I honestly don't know how either Estelle or Michael feel about each other. I would like to think that with the number of HMs getting smaller, they have simply had a bit more of a chance to talk and resolve a few things, and hopefully can just be at a place of accepting each other.
 
pwta said:
I think it is hard to say on either side. Being in the house would probably have people doing things they normally wouldn't do. There is very little stimulation, and everything is amplified e.g. if somebody does something that annoys you, it REALLY annoys you. So feelings are amplified, fights are amplified, friendships are amplified. It's just not the same as being in the real world.

I honestly don't know how either Estelle or Michael feel about each other. I would like to think that with the number of HMs getting smaller, they have simply had a bit more of a chance to talk and resolve a few things, and hopefully can just be at a place of accepting each other.
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I don't think you can equate the same ambivalence to both of them. It's such a complete 180 for Michael. He even still bitches about her. He definately came up with the plan to be nice to Estelle. The showmance angle leading to success has definitely been discussed ad nauseam. I think Stacey going pushed him and the secrets show gave him a great deal of help.

From Estelle's perspective, and I believe she's said this. She has to just keep doing what she's doing as it's clearly working. As far as the flirting? Maybe she thought be a bit close, never going anywhere might give a boost. However people have pretty much said she's flirting the same with Sam. So, I still believe most of that is purely just bullshit she's flirting or not being herself.

It seems that there is some sort of connection and friendship. With Estelle she had said ages ago she was close with Josh and Michael. There's no real change. With Michael though he's been fake to her transparently all through the season. Even discussing how hard it is. He has said horrible horrible things. In a way it's too unbelievable he's genuinely done such a back flip. That in a way you almost think there has to be something there, because why he's a shithead. It'd just make him so much more of one.
 
I think he has always been attracted to her, but didn't understand her. With so few people in the house he has got to know her a lot better and has discovered that he actually likes her.
 
yukikodancer said:
I think he has always been attracted to her, but didn't understand her. With so few people in the house he has got to know her a lot better and has discovered that he actually likes her.
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He also I think thought that he wouldn't have any chance with her. Almost every male in the house were better looking than him, plus how beautiful she is.
He wants to win and now that Estelle didn’t reject him he must feel pretty good inside. He is certain HE will win, and sadly so am I :(
 
Poona said:
Yes, it was Michael. All I can think is that he's come to appreciate her now.
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I'd like to believe that's true but it's tricky. I think maybe he was genuine when he was apologising to Estelle on the couch, but I also think he's aligning himself to what he sees as the power in the house. Estelle herself said that Michael is very strategic with everything he does.
 
pwta said:
I think it is hard to say on either side. Being in the house would probably have people doing things they normally wouldn't do. There is very little stimulation, and everything is amplified e.g. if somebody does something that annoys you, it REALLY annoys you. So feelings are amplified, fights are amplified, friendships are amplified. It's just not the same as being in the real world.

I honestly don't know how either Estelle or Michael feel about each other. I would like to think that with the number of HMs getting smaller, they have simply had a bit more of a chance to talk and resolve a few things, and hopefully can just be at a place of accepting each other.
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I think you're right. During Little Sister they all said that the emotions ran much higher in the house than outside. All the crying, fighting , friendships etc are all you would have in there and you can't just get away to take a break or have some time alone. It would be like living in a huge share house that you couldn't escape.
 
Playing the game or not Estelle has put up with a lot of grief which be mentally tough regardless of it being a game or not.
 
pwta said:
So if Michael is strategising, then maybe Estelle is too?

She is the one who has made all the first moves - wanting to spoon, running to his bed, staying in his bed. Maybe she realised Michael is also popular (with viewers) and decided to flirt with him to try and get some of his fans to like her.
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Yep, this is how the "I hate Estelle" fans see it. How dare she play the game and ruin Michael's chances of winning the game! Hmmph.

And, then you change a few words of your post and you get ...

"So if Estelle is strategising, then maybe Michael is too? He is the one who has made all the first moves - spooning, etc. Maybe he realised Estelle is also popular (with viewers) and decided to flirt with her to try and get some of her fans to like him."

Isn't it funny how it is easy to twist things around to suit a certain point of view or opinion.
 
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