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So why does Ray say sorry?

Brekkie

Well-Known Member
Staff member
Hate it when this happens but it was pretty clear with Sarah tonight that Ray did absolutely nothing wrong and Sarah over reacted, but Ray is the one who ended up apologising. Similarly with Ben the other night - can't even remember what that was over it was so petty, but Ray is the one that ends up saying sorry.

Always annoying when it isn't the person in the wrong apologising - wondering if HMs have been read the riot act on bullying so as a natural alpha male figure Ray is feeling the need to apologise everytime someone takes an issue with him, even when he's clearly not in the wrong.
 

up_all_night

Well-Known Member
Awesome site donor
Getting upset and emotional is subjective.

It's better to apologise, say I didn't mean to upset you. Than going, fuck you, i didn't intend to upset you, you're an over sensitive ****, get over it, I am not saying sorry.
 

derspatz

non green multiple site donor
Awesome site donor
+1 there, Brekkie.

Gotta agee with you, Ray of Sunshine did nothing wrong. I reckon in fact that he did everything right, and some.

... until he went and unnecessarily took responsibility for sour faced Sarah's bad behaviour and apologised to her.

I've still got a little faith left in the viewers that they are going to see it as a massive over-reaction by Sulky Sarah and that she's the party pooper and Good Times Ray did nothing wrong, though.

Maybe she's decided she's had enough of not being taken seriously, thinks she already preached everything she can re: her animal activism (perhaps BB has told her to shut up about that ?) and wants to get back home to controlling/feeding lentils to that guy of hers who writes her over the top letters ?

AFAIC, I hope she walks ... and gets a nice slap on the backside from the eyeball door on the way out.

Most of the girls won't miss her and I doubt if many of the lads will care either.

They'd prolly just ask BeeBee for some champers to celebrate such an occasion and spend the evening "remembering" her via skits, and interpretive dance, along with a bit of chewing on lemons or swigging vinegar in order to mimic some of her more typical facial expressions.

regarDS
 
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Megz1982

Guest
I agree. I so wished Ray would tell her to harden up and stop being such princess. He shouldn't have to apologise because his HM's are emotional unbalanced. This whole situation made me like Ray, who I otherwise didn't care about.
 

MistressBliss

I'm a, I'm a, a Diva
I agree. I so wished Ray would tell her to harden up and stop being such princess. He shouldn't have to apologise because his HM's are emotional unbalanced. This whole situation made me like Ray, who I otherwise didn't care about.

In the first week I would've axed him, now he's one of the more endearing house mates. I agree he shouldn't have had to apologize, but I see why he did.
 
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CottonCandy

Guest
Ray should have told her to stop being an attention seeker and drama queen.
VOTE SARAH OUT!!! (Not that we can actually vote them out but you know what I mean.)
 
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la`cat

Guest
Anything to shut the loopy sarah...and ben....up. No matter what he said or did it was going to be wrongggggg. Bradly looked so stunned and confused when the loopy one sarah was carrying on at ray.

Ben and Sarah seem to be in constant attack and pleasure police mode. Both very sensitive to imagined happenings , sayings, and that the entire world revolves around them. Loopies.
 
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supermonster

Guest
I guessing there's a bit of tension in the house over Ray. Most are quite perplexed as to why Sarah should be so upset. Sarah's muttering about a lack of respect. I'm wondering if that's something she's picking up from HMs generally. She comes across to me as up herself. HMs are polite but not loving up to her and she's probably getting that.

Ray's dancefloor serve looks to have brought matters into focus, trapped in a house with people who aren't really buying into her self affirming bullshit. There's Ray, getting into the party in a way that she can't. Everyone appears to be enjoying the scene more than her. It was an alienating moment.

She's upset. She's crying. It may be for no fault of Ray's but what's the guy gonna do? Sometimes his competitive attitude makes him look like a dickhead. He may even be one. But he's not a total bastard.
 
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CottonCandy

Guest
I just watched the video again - the ONLY reason Sarah really got upset was because she had hat hair!!! What a complete idiot for making poor Ray feel like he's in the wrong just because she was worried about a kink in her hair.
She didn't like people to see her hat hair so she turned it into something else. Sarah's the worst. Eww.
 
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ophidial

Guest
He gave Sarah a push and some other stuff which she didn't like. Sarah was ott so an apology was good and should of been the end of it.
He called Ben a poof and openly tried to engineer his eviction, apologies from both sides were warranted. Just because one side does more bitching and etc doesn't cancel out the misdeeds.
 

kbomb247

Well-Known Member
He called Ben a poof and openly tried to engineer his eviction, apologies from both sides were warranted. Just because one side does more bitching and etc doesn't cancel out the misdeeds.

Totally agree. I know Benjamin isn't an angel, but what Ray said & did was wrong.
 

Noxious

Well-Known Member
SUPER DONOR
Multiple site donor
Awesome site donor
Totally agree. I know Benjamin isn't an angel, but what Ray said & did was wrong.

I have more gay male friends than you can poke a stick at, I call them poofs all thje time and they call themselves poofs. ben is just trying to be some sort of PC gay male for reasons I cant figure out.

I mean the guy dances in to the house, then says, why must you first see me a gay? Seriously I cant work him out and I am a certified fag hag...
 

tiptop

Well-Known Member
Yes when you know someone really well it may be okay with some words.

None of my friends have ever called me a poof, simply because it is so offensive.

Ray crossed a boundary...simple

In regards to the Sarah situation, she is just a cry baby over anything.
 

kbomb247

Well-Known Member
I have more gay male friends than you can poke a stick at, I call them poofs all thje time and they call themselves poofs. ben is just trying to be some sort of PC gay male for reasons I cant figure out.

I mean the guy dances in to the house, then says, why must you first see me a gay? Seriously I cant work him out and I am a certified fag hag...

I openly, humorously & self-deprecatingly refer to myself as a "fat chick"...anyone else who called me that would at best cop a mouthful.
 
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Bungholio

Guest
dunno why he bothered apologising to either of them, both are two faced and will definitely nominate him tonight.
 

up_all_night

Well-Known Member
Awesome site donor
Yes when you know someone really well it may be okay with some words.

None of my friends have ever called me a poof, simply because it is so offensive.

Ray crossed a boundary...simple

In regards to the Sarah situation, she is just a cry baby over anything.



Now as a straight guy I can't pretend to know what is offensive or not to a gay person. I think the general rule is, if it may be offensive. Which 'poof' certainly fits into that category. You just don't say it unless you absolutely know it won't be taken with offense. One big issue people have with others taking offense is the notion of, "I didn't mean it as offensive." That doesn't negate someone taking offense. Where it comes in, is the context of what is being said.

Now we have not seen this clip. So it's all speculation. The impression I have is that it was using the word in jest. Not in an regards to a degrading comment. However that is relevant to was Ray being a homophobic bullying or not. It is not relevant to whether Ben took offensive for a variety of reasons. Maybe something like, "oh i'm just the gay guy, not just a guy." ect. Which is along the lines of where I understand most people take offense and rightfully so at such comments, even if there was no malice. Being identified as, gay, black, Asian or whatever, before just being a person. "That person only see's me as *insert offensive word.*"




There was a great insight to how people see things as differently when that whole black face Hey Hey controversy happened. Personally I think it was racist. As it fitted into, "hey look at my silly black face." Others thought... Actually I don't even know how people justified it as not being racist. Even not tied into the old america black face, it still was racist... Anyway, all sorts of people jumped up and down on Harry Connick Jr, telling him his offense wasn't valid. That's such nonsense. It offended him, obviously so and it's not being hyper sensitive. A problem people have is they enjoy or say or do something offensive. Then take offense at the offense. This is why even if you didn't mean offence, it's better to accept someone could be offended and clear the air.

So as with Ray and Sarah. Ray tried to clear the air and apologised. He apologised for causing that reaction in her. He doesn't need to base his apology on if he intended, or thought it was a justified reaction or not. That is her reaction, it was as a result of his actions. He's sorry he upset her. It's way more immature and way worse to upset someone and then blame them entirely and not take responsibility. That's what arseholes do.


Lets just extrapolate this out to a stupid extreme. If I am driving along and accidentally hit someone with my car and break their leg. Do I get out and apologise. Or do I tell them to stop being upset as I didn't intend to hit them and it was an accident and they're over reacting. Blaming them for being upset. After all I had no intention to break their leg.
 

Meglos

HAVE A NECTARINE, GONK
To me it isn't the word, it's the context and tone of voice, and the intent. If it is intended to hurt, chances are it will.
There are situations where I would accept being called a poof, & situations where I wouldn't.
 

Allgood

Active Member
To me it isn't the word, it's the context and tone of voice, and the intent. If it is intended to hurt, chances are it will.
There are situations where I would accept being called a poof, & situations where I wouldn't.

You are 100% correct. Look at when African Americans call each other N**ga. It is either used as a term of friendship like mate, or it's used as an insult, it depends on the context. My brother and I spent our whole lives calling each other kike and dirty jew, however we meant it in a joking manner (we are jews). Ray used the term poof not as a direct insult but in a joking manner. Ben pure and simple is an overreacting bitch, gay or not he is a bitch. I really liked him at the start but he is now in the Sarah category of get them the hell out ASAP!
 

tarn_seiche

Give Us Live Action BB
He's sorry he upset her.
And that is the way to go. Ben's advice to Ray in the bathroom is the worst ( I think deliberately so). Getting Ben out of the way and saying his thing to Sarah that evening (or at least, getting told by Sarah that she doesn't want to deal with him that evening), shows that he cares about her feelings and wants to be sure she is alright. Ben would love to make it look like Ben cares about Sarah's feelings, and Ray just causes trouble and slinks off until the storm dies down, and then says sorry nicely just before the noms.

I think there is more to this than we are being allowed to see - from what we can see, there is a cut between 0:18 and 0:19(Michael announces 'Smother in the House' and Sarah kicks Ray in the arse, apparently without provocation) and she doesn't seem to raise any objection until Ray pushes George onto the dance floor, and straight into her (1:10 - right on the edit, but you can tell that there was considerable force because George appears to have teleported about a metre. I am guessing he didn't go sprawling because he bounced off Sarah ). There also seems to be a bit of objectionable behaviour from Bradley that we miss most of (He boos Sarah when she suggests less violence, and he does a little bit of ripping the hat off Sarah's head (Micheal saying 'Boys on one side, Girls on the other'), in imitation of Ray, and Ray might have pushed Bradley before that as well (When Estelle first comes onto the dance floor, Bradley is her partner, then George comes in.

If you look at Zoe's re-enactment of the event in (3:25-3:26), it is not actually ripping the hat off Josh's head, but a blow to the side of Josh's head that is hard enough to knock his hat off. if you try to get a bead on Zoe's pov of the event, you can't (it cuts away while Michael goes 'it's confusion' and then only shows the dancers from the waist down) Layla admits that she had her head turned away when the action happened, and in all the footage we have, she is watching the dance floor. Michael obviously saw nothing to worry about - and I think if he had seen any violent act, he would not have ignored it, would not have said anything like 'it pisses me off when girls just won't admit it' whatever 'it' is. In fact, none of the boys seem to have seen anything.
It also seems to have been made into a much bigger deal after the fact, or to have included some further aggravation between the time Ray apologised on the dance floor and the time Sarah went to the bedroom. By the time she is in the bedroom (drinking chocolate milk!) she is saying that it was shock as much as anything and that it isn't a big deal, but by that point the boys seem to think it is a big deal and necessary to consult the rules (their rules seem to be a lot more detailed than the ones on the website). Maybe Big Brother has said something to stir them up by then. When Josh says that Ray was just dancing with his back to her, Sarah explains that it was more than that - although exactly what beyond 'he pushed me a couple of times' is drowned by Josh and Zoe.

I am not sure if Ray has underestimated his strength, or if he is pulling an old body-builders trick (when you have a big frame and a lot of muscle, you can get some surprisingly forceful jabs in without other people noticing what you are doing - a version of 'Why are you hitting yourself?'), but I don't think Sarah is complaining of the things we are seeing. From the video it looks like she gave at least as much as she got, and there has been a ridiculous drama over absolutely nothing, much later on and Ray did nothing wrong at all.
 
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